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Northern Star (1837-1852), 2nd July 1842, Edition 5 of 5, Page 6, Untitled Article

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      HOUSE OF LORDS-JV / ontf ^ , June 27 . Lord Denmxs moved the second reading of the Affirmation Bill . His object in this measure 'was to give relief to those Christians who literally interpret the command , ¦ *• Swear not at all , " and -who conscientiously act on their convictions ; and to enable them to further the ends of justice by giving their evidence without violating their conscientious feelings . The Earl of Wicklow opposed the bill , being more disposed to support a measure for the abrogation of oaths altogether The Bishop of London felt himself in a difficulty . He respected the conscientious ? crnples of the persons for whose relief the bill was brouiht forward , and

      ¦ was a-vrare that , aruorgst other mstanees of hardship , there -was the case ol a distinguished member of th 6 bar , ¦ who had foregone the emoltuneniB of office rather than violate his convictions by taking the oaths required . Believing that the entire subject nmst be dealt -w . th legislatively at no distant period , he ¦ w ould abstain from either supporting or opposing , the present bilL In the course of the further debate , Lord -Abisger protested against the case of the Quakers being taken as a precedent ; he found them , as witnesses , exceedingly QiSsnlt to manage , as they never gave a direct answer to any question . Lords Brougham and Denman defended the Quakers from the imputations of Lord Abinger .

      On a suggestion from the Bishop of London , which w : is supported by the Lord Chancellor , the bill was withdrawn , en the understanding that the entire subject is to be referred to a ielect committee , -with a view to some future legislative proceedings .

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      HOUSE OF COMMONS , Friday , June 24 . Petitions were presented against the present system of rational education in Ireland , against the Poor Law Continuance Bui , and for a better system for the regulation of medical charities in Ireland . On the motion for going into committee on the Poor Law Amendment Bill , being read , ill . LaWso ^ movfcd , that it be an instmetion to the committee tfcat they have powtr te divide the bill into two parta . The motion having been seconded ,

      Sir J . Gkahaii said , it "would not be necessary for him to detain the House at any length in opposing the motion . He introduced this measure on the 4 th of May . and many of the clauses were considered in the last session . The Hon . Gentleman said he had no objection to the first five clauses , which , in his opinion , -were the most kuportani in the bilL He considered the motion of the Hen . Member useless and superfluous , and , therefore , he hoped the House woald proceed to consider the Bill in committee . Captain Pechell supported the motion for dividing the Poor Law Bill into two parts . -

      Dr . Booking said it could net be denied but that grt-at abuses existed under the old Poor Law Bill , and therefore he voted for the bill , ¦ which had for its object the amendment of that law . Whether the new me&rxus bad worked well , it "waB for the House to consider—( hear ,. Certainly cases of iffiiction and suffering had taken place lately , which were a disgrace to a civilised country—; h * ar }—and the inquiry "which had taken place was net satisfactory to any party . He wished this important Bill to be thoroughly discussed in every stage , and he "would not avail himself ol the technical forms of the House to oppose the BilL He would not offer any factious opposition . Mr . O Consell should vote with the government on the present occasion . He was decidedly vf opinion that this important measure ought to be in one Bill ; it ought not to be divided .

      ilr . Fieldes said , he believed this bill ought not to pass , and , therefore , he should oppose it in every tray the forms of the House allowed . He should vote for the amendment which had been proposed . Sir H . W . BiRaos considered the New Poor La-w Bill the most beneficial measure ever passed by the Legislature , and when its provisions "were thoroughly understood and fully carried ont , the country -would think as he did . It -would pTove a benefit to both poor and rich—ihear . ) It was the cry of eternal war on the hustings at the last election against the Poor Laws and the Corn Laws that placed the present ministers of the Government in the situations they now Leld—hear . ) He ftlt bound to support the bill , but he ccnld not support their general policy . Mr . Gsimsditch was of opinion no benefit cculd be derived by dividing tha bill into two parts , therefore he must oppose the motion .

      After a few -words from General JOH > "SO > ' ( cnes of "Dirid * , divide . ") Sir . Lawsos said hfi would not trouble the House to divide , he would withdraw his motion . llotkn withdrawn . On the motion being again put that the Speaker do leave ths chair , Mr . T . S . DO'COiiBE rese and moved the following resolution : — " That , considering the distressed state of the commercial and indnstrious classes of this country , together with the advanced period of the session , and the

      present sts . te of public business , ecupled with , the fa « t that the Poor Law Commission expires on the 31 st of the ensuing month , it is the opinion of this House that there is cot now sufficient time to enable Parliament to give that attention and deliberation to the important changes in the laws for the administration of relief to the poor , which the measure introduced by her ilajestj ' ^ } I roisters imperativ ely demands ; and that it would therefore be more expedient , that measures ef a temporary character should , be adopted , to meet any inconvenience which the expiring provisions of existing lawB for the relief of the poor may be deemed to reooire . "

      The Hon . Member contended that this important Bill conld not be properly and satisfactorily considered during ihe pres-nt Etsfeion of Parliament . The existing Bill expired on the 31 st of July , and therefore a temporary measure ought to be introanced , and the questions respecting the same fuL ' y and calmly discufised in the nex = session of Parliament He did rot think that any orje ^ tion would be raiBed to continuing the present Bill for another year , but in the present state of public bnsi » ess they ought not to be called upon to pass a perusaaest Act . Tts Bill ought to have been introduced at an earlier "Dsriod of the session .

      3 Ir . Wallace seconded the motion . He eloquently expatiated upon the apathy exhibited by both sides of the Hunse respecting the afiairs of the poor ; but he ¦ would do his duly to them , for the poor ought eo ! to be allowed to starve . The Poor Law did not provide for ihe destitute . He wonld , with the assistance of four or five individuals , bring the affair shortly befere the House . Sir James Gkahah admitted the importance of tbe question now before the house , and he "was deeply

      impressed with the distressed condition of the working classes . But it was now a question how those difficulties should be met . There were now 1 , 200 , 000 perfecnB in England and "Wales receiving parochial relief . Now how was this gigantic evil to be relieved ? He had considered the qaestion in all its bearings ; and be had recommended the adoption of various expedients from time to time . He was quite prepared to enter into details of tbe measure , with a view to apply a remedy to the existing evils , if possible . He would Tote for the government measure .

      iir . HUME said , that he had always approved of this mtasure ; yet he regretted it had not answered thb purp-jsa for wbicu it hart been brought forward . He thought it would be expedient to past a bill of a temporary nature for one or two years ; for Parliament had passe J a bill to prevent tbe poor mas from working J ( Ht-ar , hear . ) The poor want to work , buther Majesty ' s minsters "will not let them have it ! Had they not passed the corn laws , -which deprive them of woik ? They do not want charity . Let tbe House remove restrictions on trade . Gentlemen may say " No , no , "

      but the time was at hand when they wonld be compelled to comply . Ltt the Right Hon . Baronet consider that in a few months those countries "which depended upon our commerce would be independent of us . He rep-. ated , that free trade in com and provisions , and nothing else , wonld give employment to the poor man . Thry cculd not have the poor law and the corn law togtth&r ; for Bociety would then be divided into classes —the very rich , and the very poor . The poor "were degraded and trampled upon ; and the time was approaching when the rich themselves "would suffer .

      Ml . LlDDELL "Wirlltd that hfel iSsjfcfcty ' s ministers ¦ would limit the present till to the first five clause * . By this measure the Gilbert Unions and the district panper schools would not be touched . He maintained that the measure would not afford the smallest additional rtslitf ; and the removal of restrictions on trade . would only aggravate tb . 9 eviL Lord Johk KCSS £ LL said , the number of poor ¦ would be very considerable , whatever might be the fate cf the corn laws ; and it "wonld still be requisite to nave a good system of poor laws ; and no change of tie corn Iswb could make it expedient to pnt np -with a bad . or injudicious system of poor law administration . "Upon those grounds he opposed the motion . Colonel Wood was of opinion that the house should ini-erfera , « sd not allow the out-door redel to fee administered by capricious commissioners .

      Jlr . Pxxs _ HD was convinced that the Poor Law Commissioner and Assistant-Commissioners would uphold any system which gave them the control of the public money —(" Oh , oh ! " ) He felt it dne to himself s a nwmber of tbe Keighley Board of Guardians , as Chairman of the Board , and as a Magistrate of the county in wMchthe union was established , to prove to the noose and to the country , that a statement -which tad been made respecting him by a public officer , in & report now ha believed on the table of tbe boose ,

      • was & false and scandalous one —( " Oh , oh V ) He did cot speak on rumour , like the Hon . Member for Bath , but has much stronger grounds foi tbe confidence with which be made bis assertions . He would prove from the report of Sir J . Walsham , that tbe statement made by acMott was false . Tbe Bight Son . Baronet , tbe Seoexary for tbe Home Department made it his boast the othes ' sight-that Government bad not betrayed th § confluence which tbe house reposed in them , when it granted the additional day for public business ; but he ¦ would tell tbe Hon Baronet that tie ccuntry bad been

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      betrayed when it placed confidence in the Government , when—( cheers , and cries of " Oh , oh ! " during the remainder of the sentence ) . He cared not for friend or foe , but would Bpeak his opinions boldly . The Government had been raised to power by the deeprooted hatred which the people tore to the New Poor Law . It was the detestation , of that law which placed the Conservative candidates at the' head of the poll . It waB to raise their voices against that law that they were returned to that house , and he stood there to perform the duty for which be had been sent . Tbe Noble Lord epposite last year introduced his Bill , and took his stand upon it . What was the consequence ? Tbe country , when the general election came , told the Noble Lord that they would not have his bill nor him either .

      This only carried out the argument of the Hon . Baronet , the Member for Waterford , who said that the Government had obtained their majority in that House bythe-agitation cf this question . What was the difference between the Hon . Gentleman and himself ? The Hen . Gentleman , he believed , agitated for the Beptal of the "Union—he ( Mr . F errand ) agitated for the repeal of the Poor Law . The Right Hon . Member for the county of Cork also agitated for the Repeal of tbe Union , but he ( Mr . Ferrand ) believed they would carry the rtptal of the Poor Law before the Right Hon . Gentleman carried the Repeal of tbe Union . He lMr . Ferrand ) would cow call the attention of the House to Borne statements in Mr . Motfs report . He found that Mx . Mott said , " I regret to have to report to yonr board that tbe proceedings of the guardians are very

      . unsatisfactory ; in short , they are entirely at variance with the provisions of the law and the directions ol your beard . " He ( Mr . Ferrand ) begged leave to assure the House that tbe Board of Guardians of the Keighley Union had been carrying on the whole of their proceedings , since he himse . f attended the board , according to the express directions of the Commissioners of Somerset-house . This was directly contrary to the alterations of the Commissioners themselves . Ho held in Lis hand the report of the Poor Law Commissioners for 1639 . The following passages described the atate of the unions in Lancashire and the northern districts , and the manner in which the law was carried out ;—" We are enabled to state generally , in reference to these nni&n . " , that the boards of guardians are proceeding satisfactorily in the administration of relief .

      * * * * * * The Kame observations apply to many of the unions in t £ e West Riding of York , which have been longest in eperation . * * The guaTdians are authorised to put the law into operation vnder and subject to tbe provisions of the 43 dEi : zsbeth , c 2 , ithe old law ) , and are , in fact , a larger vestry , before whom the cases of tbe respective paupers are investigated on their own personal application or from the report of the relieving officers , whose duty it is to aiminister the relief ordered bf the board , ami t « i ; quire into tko situation of tbe paupers making application , and the board of guardians have reason to believe that the real wants and necessities of the poor are more promptly attended to

      and ie \ ieved than under the old law . " He begged tbe particular attention of the House to these extracts , which would shonw the system by whicb the Poor Law Commissioners gulled the public , sending assistantcommissieners up and down the country to deceive the House and the Government . He would take the liberty of reading an extract from the report of Sir J . Walsham , relative to the Keighley Union , which would confirm what he bad stated relative to the inaccuracy of Mr . Mott ' s report : — " The expenditure on iis poor , and principally , I taKe it , on its non-settled poor , has more than doubled itself since the declaration of the Union in February , 1837 ; a glance at the subjoined table will at once show this to be the case : —

      Average quar- J teily Expen- Expenditure yames of dituts foi tht fer the Increase Townships . Three Years Quarter end- per ending March ing March Cent . 25 , 1 S 37 . 25 , 1842 . 1 . Bingley 2 S 6 666 133 2 . Haworth 23 S 499 110 3 . Keighley 363 767 111 4 . Marion 74 1 m 2 38 5 . Steeton 43 75 I 74 6 . Sutton 87 160 I 84 Total j 1091 | 2 269 i 108

      An increase of IPS per cent , indicates , pn ' ma facia , a loose and imperfect administration , and it caused me , therefore , no surprise to hear that out-door relief and non-resident relief in aid of wages , given almost wholly in money and without requiring work in return , was ths system on whicb tha board of guardians of tbe Keighly Union bad been proceeding . But it is Boine satisfaction to add , that not only did the guardians seem fully aware and willing to admit that such system was unsound , and ought to be checked , but they were tnrteavouring to make arrangements with the surveyors of the highways in the several townships fur providing work for the able-bodied . I am not , however , prepared tossy that these arrangements will be adequate to their purpose , or to tbe rf quisitions of the cut-door

      labour test recently issued to the Keighly Union ; still th ? y involve a movement in the right direction , and as the guardians disposed ( so as least it struck me ) of the business btfore them in a business-like ma ;; ner , I am not inclined to augur unfavourably of their future proceedings as regards a more Bjstematic and correct distribution of out-relief . " One great cause of the increase of the rates , apparent on tbe face » f tbe extract he bad read , was the bringing such numbers of men from the southern and other agricultural districts into the manufacturing parishes of Lancashire . It was a fact that some of these men were now receiving from the parishes whence they had been transported thirteen pounds a year in aid of wages . If any improvement bad been made in the woiking of the

      law , be ( Mr . Ferrand ) would say that it was owing entirely to the exertions of its uncompromising and determined opponents , and of tbe boards ef guardians , whe had been obliged to set tbe commissioners at defiance , and act contrary to their direction * . That was owing solely to the arbitrary , unconstitutional , monstrous , inhuman , un-Christian , un-English orders which the latter occasionally issued . Were such men , be would ask , to be intrusted with the administration of the workhouse test ? He now came to the clese of Mr . Mott ' s report ; and what would the Right Hon . Baronet say when be beard what was there stated ?—" Without proper workhouse accommodation I am afraid that other restraints upon the guardians would be but of little avail . As tbe auditors are now elected .

      their services in many unions are but of little use , and no beneficial check can be expected through them . I have repeatedly ventured to state to your board , and all recent experience has confirmed the opinion I have btfore expressed , that even as a precautionary measure , in the manufacturing districts , where the poor-rates , until recently , have been comparatively light , the provisions of the New Poor Law are loudly called for ; and that unless the Poor Law Commissioners are empowered by the Legislature to enforce the provision for proper workhouse accommodation to aid the restraint upon relief to able-bodied paupers , there is nothing to prevent tbe pressure of the poorrates in tbe manufacturing districts from becoming ten -times more ruinous in their consequence and more

      dangerous to the public welfare than those which were unhappily witnessed in tbe agricultural districts of the south of England . " Now , he would ask the Right Hon . Gentleman what kind of podrhouses they were going to erect ? The feeling in that district was most determined in opposition this measure The people in the north of ^ England were unanimous almost to a nun against it— : ( hear , hear . ) This indeed was no party queition , for if it were did they think he would stand up in that House and express his opinions to the injury of the Government?—( tear , bear . ; But the question they had to decide was whether the northern parts of England should be completely ruined , the working

      classes there be made determined haters of tbe institutions of their country , and the men of property be made to feel that every principle of the constitution bad been violated . The Bight Hon . Gentleman knew it was impossible to carry out the orders that were issued ; the commissioners knew it too , and yet , in spite of the state in whicb tbe union of Keighlfey was , they issued the directory orders to which he had alluded . Hejiad no hesitation then in saying that the commissioners were more anxious to preserve their places and their pay than to care Iot the public welfare . Had the people of this country become so degraded from every principle that actuated their ancestors , that three Poor "Caw- commissioners at Somerset-house were rendered

      necessary for providing for the poor ? He challenged the Right Hon . Gentleman te prove a tingle instance , under the old law , of a ratepayer in the Keighley Union , of any party , who was even actuated by one unkind feeling towards tbe poor , or who ever forgot his duty to them . He was now Chairman of the Guardians of that Union , and a short time since . when he found these peremptory orders had been sent down , as Chairman of the Board , and as a magistrate , he officially communicated to the Right Hon . Gentleman , that if those orders were carried out , he felt convinced a breach of the peace would take place . What was the answer of the Right Hon . Baronet , the Secretary of State for the Home Department—the guardian of the poor of the country ? That he could not interfere . '—( bear . ) But be would atk tbe Right Hon . Bart . whether he bad not acted as the Chairman of a Board of Guardians and as a magistrate of Cumberland ? Did he allow any Poor Law Commissioners to interfere

      with " * him ? Did be allow them to step in with their authority ? No . Tben let the same motives which actuated the Bight Bon . Baronet as Chairman of a Board of Guardians in Cumberland be attributed to him in his position as Chairman of the Keighley Union—( hear . ) He held in bis hand an extract from a speech of the Right Hon . Gentleman on tbe 20 th of July , 1839 , and he could assure the Right Hon . Gentleman that " Hansard" bad been a great comfort to him aince he had had tbe interview with him—( a laugb . ) The Right Hont Gentleman said the other night that be possessed considerable influence in Cumberland . [ Sir J . Graham intimated that be had Dot said so . ] The Right Hon . Bart said that he had considerable property there , and property generally gave influence ; but at any rate he wished that he had more . ( "Hear , " and a laugh . ) The speech whicb he "was about to quote was made when Lord J . Russell moved the order of the day for going into committee on the Poor Law Bill ; and the Right Hon . Gentleniaa then said , — " When the Com-

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      missioners of Semerset-hoase came practically to consider tbe prudence of carrying ont this regulation ( the refusal of out-door relief ) , tke inquiries they made , and the experience they had acquired , taught them the impossibility of giving general effect to tbe law . Uniformity was desirable . This rale , prohibiting the administration of out-door relief , so far frem being general throughout England , was , he must say , somewhat caprlciously applied . It was applied to certain unions in tbe south , but in the north the rule was Dot in operation . In Cumberland , in the union of which he was chairman , they were bound by no such regulation : An ample discretion was It-ft them ; they were sot fettered in the least ; and if they had not been left to the exercise of this unfettered discretion , be was bound to say ,

      he should not have held himself responsible during the last winter for the conduct of that union . " He said it was monstrous , it was most unjust , that three Poor Law Commissioners , so grossly ignorant as he had proved these men to be , should make those orders , whicb , if carried out , must reduce this country to a state of anarchy and confusion—increase the enormous rates which be had brought before the House—which must turn the aged and infirm out of their honieB , and carry out the labour test amongst a population of 50 . 000 personB , who had now scarcely the means of getting a single day ' s employment But let him ask the Right Honourable Baronet this—Were those orders issued by the Poor Law Commissioners for the purpose of tearing from their homes persona of seventy ,

      eighty , and ninety years of age , who were , to a certain extent , relieved by the feelings of charity which imbued the breat * of their poor neighbours—that when a slight assistance from the board of guardians or ratepayers would enable them to be carried from the hearth on which they sat to their final resting place in the church-yard , they were to be dragged to a union workhouse , in defiance of every feeling which the laws of this country had raised within them , until the people were taught to regard a workhouse as a prison?—( bear . ) Was it not monstrous that the commissioners should havd issued those orders at that very moment in tbe Ktiighley Union , that , when carried out , and they must be if it were possible , would tear the aged and infirm from their peaceful homes , no longer to

      enjoy their evening walk by the mountain's side or in tbe shaded lanes , but to be immured within prison walls , to have every feeling disregarded , and to be imp . isoned in a onion workhouse \ He would tell the Right Hon . Member and the country that the people would not submit to it —( hear , hear . ) He would tell the Right Hon . Gentleman that tbey would not submit to it in Cumberland ; they would not submit to it in Yorkshire —( bear . ) He would tell him that the same spirit which actuated tbe board of guardians o / er which he presided would actuate every man who had any feeling for the poor —( hear , bear . ) He would , tor a moment , allude to what he considered an extraordinary circumstance ; and that was , that when the Noble Lord , the member for London , on the 21 st of

      July , 1840 , moved the third reading of the New Poor Law Commission Continuance Bill , there were absent the following members of the present Government , —Sir R . Peel , Sir J Graham , Lord Stanley , SirF . Pollock , and Sir W . Follett . That was an extraordinary circumstance ; but that very circumstance was the cause of hundreds of votes being given for the supporters of the Government at the last election . —( hear , hear , hear . ) He himself then said to his constituents , " Trust in tbe Conservatives ; you have tried the Whigs for ten years , and they have given you the New Poor Law and measures that have been to your great injury . " Their answer was , " Yes ; but Sir R . Peel will not Bay anything at all . " ( "Hear , " and a laugh . ) He replied , " Trust to him ; be does not promise

      everything and perform nothing ; but he promises nothing , and will perform everything . " ( Great laughter ) But what said the Right Hon . Baronet at the head of the Government on the 8 th of February , on the bill of the Noble Lord the Member for London , to continue tbe Poor Law Commission for ten years ? " He said— "It was necessary for him to state , however , that in voting for the second reading , he reserved to himself the fullest right of judging of the propriety or of rejecting any of tbe clauses , and of dissenting from any provisions by which the power of the present law was to be Increased or amended . He doubted particularly the propriety of continuing the commission for so long a time . He did not mean to say , that after an experience of a further continuance for a short period he

      might not come to the conclusion that the powers given by the present law should still exist ; and that the continuance of the commissioners might not be advantagecus , or that be might net deem such further cantinuance advisable ; but it would , in his opinion be more consonant to the opinion of the country that tbe subject should again , at a short period , come necessarily under the consideration of the House . " "Then , " said the people , " Lord J . Russell proposed a continuance of the bill for ten years , Sir R . Peel only proposes It for five , and afterwards we shall come down to noyearsall . " ( Laughter . ) However , the Right Hod . Baronet appealed to public opinion , and long before he did so , he told the people that the battle of the constitution was to be fought in the registration coutts . Now ,

      tbe great argument of the persons who conducted those courts in the North of England was that this particular law was contrary to the . constitution . ( Hear . ) Public opinion then carried the Right Hon . Baronet into p * wer . He would ask him wbat was public opinion now in tbe North of EnglaDd ? ( Hear . ) It was almost unanimous in opposition to this Bill —( Hear , hear . ) And he would tell tbe Right Hon . Baronet that if he carried this law into the North of England , his Government would not exist two years— ( hear , bear . ) . He believed that that would be the case . Was tbe Right Hon . Baronet aware of the state of public feeling in tbe north of England wherever this law had been introduced ? Was he aware , too , that that feeling was increasing rapidly in the south of Eagland ?—( hear , hear . ) Because it

      saved the public pockets to a email amount , it was said to work well . He should bu very glad to bear what the Hon . and Learned Member for Bath weuld say upon the subject . It was said by some—•• Oh ! it works well in our neighbourhood : —leave well alone . " But how bad it Worked well ? By saving the money of the ratepayer—( hear . ) It was entirely opposed to the constitution of this country , and that he meant to show , if it were allowed—as be hoped it would not be—to go to a third reading—( hear , hear . ) Was the Right Hon . Baronet aware that the Conservative press of the country was almost universally against bim upon this subject ? Was he aware that tbe daily press was taking op this question , and roust work its way through public opinion ?—( hearj . Was he aware

      that tbe weekly press was taking it up , and must shake him in bis position ? ( Hear , hear . ) Because , if he were not , be could tell him that it was so , and that no Government could stand long under such circumstances . ( Hear . ) He would give him two years to destroy the public feeling which bad been raised in his favour . ( Hear . ) He could not resist public opinion , and the opinion of the press of this country ; and he must ultimately yield to it . ( Hear . ) He wished now to have a few words with the Right Hon , Baronet the Secretary for the Home Department . The Right Hon . Baronet had , the other evening , in rather , be must Bay , a warm manner , attacked him for using what be termed vielent means for excitiDg an opposition to this measure ( as we understood ) . He plainly confessed that since this

      law passed be had taken a determined and firm stand upon this question ; he bad addressed a public meeting of guardians , and told them , that by every constitutional means in his power he w # uld resist the measure ; but at the same time he preached te them in the beat manner he could the necessity of obedience to the laws . Was it rigbfc for the Right Hon . Baronet to attack him for that ? The Right Hon . Baronet forgot that he himself had lived in a glass house . ( Hear , and laughter . ) He must remember that he was a member of the Reform Ministry . How did the Governmental that time inflame the minds of the people ? Was it

      not a fact that they were in correspondence . with the men who said that there were thousands reudy to march to London for the purpose of cramming the Reform Bill down the threats ef the people ? And did not the GoTernment give them their thanks ? ( Cheers . ) " We never refused , ( said the Hon . Gentleman ) to pay our rates in suppert of the poor of this country ; we never have excited the people to attack the Monarch while passing through the streets of the Metropolis ; nay , we have never advised the monarch , fer the purpose of carrying a measure , to swamp one branch of the Legislature . ( Hear . ) We never have attempted to bully the House of Peers i nor have we ad vised a circular te

      be written to one branch of the Legislature asking them to forget their duty to themselves and to their country . ( Hear , hear . ) No ; I tell the Right Hon . Baronet I aland upon firmer ground . I appeal to tbe Constitution of the Country , and taking my stand under the banner of that Constitution , come weal or come woe , I will fight tbe battle of tbe people . ( Hear . ) [ Sir R . Peel here rose and left tha House ] The Right Hon . Baronet has gone a minute too soon . ( Laughter . ) For what did tbe Right Hon . Gentleman say in the debate that took place on this subject March 19 th , 1841 ? He said , "He should consider the large powers entrusted to them , and , hating devolved those powers , the greater tbey were the more jealousy must Parliament exercise with respect to their application , and the greater tbe

      readiness with which they must listen to any allegations of abuse . While he consented to tbe prolonged duration of the commission for five years , he must say that he wished the commissioners would watch the expressions they made use of with a little more circumspection . He thought that with the best intentions there was occasionally a hi \ y « h "'" displayed in the vindication of certain principles which might be avoided consistently with the maintenance of the law , and the avoidance of which would tend to fortify the powers of the commissioners . To give an illustration of this , he would take for instance an official circular published by the Poor Law Commissioners , one of those public

      documents directed by the board to be printed chitfly for the use of the guardians . In one of those papers be found the following expressions : — 'One principal abject of a compulsory provision for tbe relief of destitution is the prevention of almsgiving . ' Why , he heard the Noble Lord { J . Russell ) himself state that the Poor Law wonld completely fail in effect if the affluent withheld their alms . That was perfectly true ; and he should abominate the Poor Law if he thought it relieved the rich from the duiy of almsgiving . He was perfectly certain the Poor Law would fail if the affluent relying npon its provisions alone , however improved the system of administration might be , felt that the moral obligation on them to attend to the wants of their poorer neighbours were

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      thereby extinguished . " What , he would ask ( proceeded the Hon . member ) bad become el almsgiving ? What was the result of the Queen ' a letter for a collec tion for the distressed manufacturers ? Why , the New Poor Law bad dried up the springs of charity—( hear ) and the poor were to become prisoners , and wear a prison dress—men who had committed no other crime than taking advantage of the negleat of duty of their superiors , and to choose as their means of existence the poor-rates of the parish , which were given to theru by their superiors under the old law . If th ^ rich forgot their duty—if they broke the law—if the magistrates , who were the guardians and protectors ef the laws of this country , forgot their duty in the south of Englsrwl , could they wonder that the poor man forgot his duty

      too . '—( hear , hear . ) He cared not who the nian was who had not rather live in ease than earn his bread by the sweat of his brow . . Providtnce had ordained that they ( the Members of the House of Caramons ) should not earn their j bread by the sweat of their brow ; but if through His beneficence . He had placed in the bauds of certain parts of the population of thia ^ country the means of existing without such labour , depend upon it thoy would have to give a true account of their stewardship —( hear . ) He had that night given his reasons for opposing the continuance of the po wars of the commission . In the majority of ; the Government there would be some who were generally their opponents , but whe advocated this measure ; but he would beg from

      the opponents of the Government their votes upon this occasion . The Rubt Hon . Baronet might find on those ( tbe Ministerial ) benches Borne : who would find it difficult to explain away their votes to their constituents—( hear , hear)—and who would stand by him in fighting this battle against the Constitution of their country ; but the tilne would come ¦ when old English feelings would return—when they would ask themselves whether they had performed their duty as members of society ? and whether they would stand by a Minister of the Crown , ' whatever his political opinions might be , who was disposed to defer to the opinions of a few against the feelinga i of a vast majority of the country ? —( hear . )

      Colonel Wood ( Middlesex ) said he hoped the measure would be tukun into the immediate consideration of tbe House . He must say that he thought the New Porr Law was a very treat advantage to the poor , and it had materially added to their comforts . Mr . Wortley would give his vote with the Hon . Member for Finfibury , in the present state of the question before the House . Mr . Waialey said that the next election the gallant Colonel ( Wood ) would be defeated in consequence of his advocacy of this measure , and Honourable Gentlemen should be very guarded in their actions . There would be great difficulty in preaervipg the peace of the country . There were hungry thousands now , but soon there would be hungry millions ! Is such a law

      calculated to preserve the peace of the country ? Ho hoped the Hon . Barouet did not think so . Considering the awful prospect which the state of the country presented , he was willing to vote for the continuance of the present law for one year longer . This was a question of vital importance , involving the welfare and happiness of myriads of the people ; and he hoped the Right Hon . Baronet would take the matter into bis most serious consideration . He would ask thia question—Are we legislating with a conviction that the poor of this country have a right to relief ? The Hop . Member for Bath denies it . Now , he would say that his ( tbe Hon . Member ' s ) mindis bo constituted that he is not fit to : tr £ islate for the poor . It bad been complained of by a commissioner , that " paupers

      insolently claim relief as a rigbl ! " Now , if you admitted this , who could be responsible for atarvin ? them . Now , if there was nothing else than this , ho would vote against the continuance of the commissioners for six years , unlesB a man who had dared to make such a statement , was discharged . He quoted details from Mr . Mott ' s report , to prove the existence of monstrous and scandalous abuses in the present system . Tbe House may be assured ( he said ) that the existing distress is dreadful ! Hundreds of poor traversing the connrty in all directions , sleeping in the bauds , and sheds ; and they said they would rather die than go into the

      union workhouses ! It was impossible that the bill could be disposed of this session , and he would recommend ( though unwillingly ) its continuance for one year . Sir T . CocuraNE contended that relief afforded to the people should be such as would be agreeable to them . He wished to know whether they considered it as a boon ? and he regretted to say that he thought it was not the case . Much bad been said about the abuses of the old law ; but this was a poor argument in favour of the imperfections of the new one . He thought that tbe poor should be taught habits of industry and sobriety . Ha should vote against the resolution .

      Mr . Roebuck referred to tke conduct of tbe former government , When the measure was firat brought before the House , it was considered one of great danger to the country ; retribution was now coming upon them ; for they had made use of vulgar passions and prejudices to endeavour to oust people . The law gave to the poor that right which they sought . He was . not to be assailed by declamation , but he would admit that it was a general benefit , and therefore just . The aged poor were * provided for by the law . He was not , however ,

      very . fond of the conitnission .. The poor should be maintained in such a manner as should preserve industrious habits , and not foster idle ones . The question was . how we should provide for the destitution which prevailed ; and , at the same time check habits of idleness ? He would give the relief , because it was to the interest of the community that it should be given . The principle of the Poor Law should be , that it should discourage the impositions of tbe designing and idle , and , at the Fame time , afford relief to those who were really destitute .

      Sir R . Peel hoped that in the progress of the New Poor Law bill no factious opposition would be offered to it . The general opinion of the country , he contended , was favourable to the measure , and the proof of this he found in the insignificant number of petitions which hail been presented to the House against it . The Hon . Gentleman who had spoken last wished to know why be ( Sir B . Peel ) had not influenced the party who followed him more in favour of the measure than they were . He confessed that he did not think the gentlemen of England were so easy drilled into an opinion . ( Ironical cheers from the opposition 1 He saw no reason why he should exert his censorship over Honourable Gentlemen who sat on his side of the House , With regard to this question , be did not think that be

      had power to do so . The Noble Lord opposite bad not been more successful in this particular than himself . With respect to the use made of the cry against the Poor Law last election by gentlemen on this side of the House , he could only Bay that he should be ashamed of his place if he thought that he had glined power by such ineaps . He had never for a moment given his sanction to such a course of proceeding ; on the contrary , he bad taken opportunities of stating his concordance with the principles of that MIL In the general election of 1837 , he stated bu the hustings his conviction of its justice , and that he would give it his cordial support In the election of 1841 , he gave his support to the Government on every occaesion on which it was broueht forward . He was surprised at

      the ignorance of some Hon . Members as to the degree in which the enactments of Elizabeth are departed from in the present measure . It was well to leofc at these enactments by way of forming a comparison between them and the present l » w . In these enactmentB he saw no recognition of a right to relief without giving labour for it If such had been the case there would have been an end to society ( bear , hear . ) it was not so , however ; so little was the principle recognised of an indefeasible right to reiief on the part of the poor , that they even requirtd the children to be apprenticed to some handicraft There was no difference in principle in the existing law and the old one of Elizabeth . The existing law was a great check upon local abuBe . He ( Sir R , P . ) hoped they would not wish to return to

      the old system—they were asked to tiust to the good English feeling and all that stuff . The Right Hon . Bart then read some abstraets from Mr . Mott ' s report of the Keighley Union—a union which had long resisted the . influence of the poor law . A Union of which the Hon . Member for Knareaborough waa the chairman , and which he had spoken so highly of . Mr . Mott ' s letter unfolds some of tbe most frightful scenes of immorality and vice in that very Union . How would that union contrast with those which were under the management of the new poor law ? He thought the Hon . Member for Knaresborough would have been better employed in remedy ing those abuses which should have come under hia eye , in bi 8 capacity as chairman , than in babbling of green fields . "

      Mb . FEBBA . ND said , as his conduct bad been animadverted upon by the Right Hon . Baronet , he should say a few words in explanation , y the allegations in Mr . Mott ' s report Were correct and capable of proof , they wore worthy of serious consideration . But he believed that the guardians of the Keighley Union would be able to clear themselves of the aspersions heaped upon them . Lobd HowicK ' said that no time , so much as the present , required the greatest caution in the management of the distributipn of relief , when the country was in such a state that the rates had increased in a frightful degree . The sources from which relief flowed were growiDgmore scant , while the recipients were hourly on the increase . He thought in such

      a state of things , there was the greatest necessity of a cautious and economical system of relief , such as that practised by the commissioners . Nothing would be more productive of additional misery to the country than a relaxed administration of the poor law . He did not entertain the idea that the Right Hon . Baronet could be expecte . d to be answerable for every speech made by his side of the house . But he did think it strange that his ( Sir R . Peel ' s ) influence was not greater with those who were nearly cohhectfld with him . He thought the Right Hon . Baronet could not take credit for himself for having discouraged the vulgar outcry against the New Poor Law at the last election . He should , however , support . the ' Bill . r v

      Sir E . Knatchbull said he rose to give an answer to some imputations thrown out against him by the Noble Lord who had just spoken ; It had been imputed to him that he was inconsistent in supporting a measure now which he had formerly opposed . He begged to say the Noble Lord was in orror . He

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      had always given his opinion in favour of the general principle of the Poor Law ; like other members , he had views of his own as to the details . After a few words from Mr . Pabby and Captain P 6 LLABD , „ Mr . O'Coknell said he agreed with the motion of the Hon . Member for Finsbury . _ He did so , how * ever , more mtb respect to Ireland , in which country the Poor Law was a new scheme ..- He had from the first been opposed to that scheme , » 3 irreconcilable to the feelings of the people of Ireland . He had prophesied that commotions would ; follow the introduction of this system , and he was only afraid those prophesies were working themselves out . He feared that a revolt would be produced by that measure , more terrible in its resuHs than any thing that they had ever before seen in that unhappy country . .

      Lord Elliot said he must rise to defend the Poor Law Commissioners of Ireland against the attacks of the Honi Member for Cork . They had followed up their labours in a spirit of candour and earnestness , and , as far as the experiment of the poor law had been tried in that country , it had been perfectly successful ; They had few able-bodied men in their workhouses , but these were not the iind of persons they wished to have , but the lame and the infirm . His lordship concluded by complimenting Mr . O'Connell for the forbearance he had shown in not opposing what he did hot agree with . Mr , CcBDEN said they lost sight of what was the real motion to night . The Hon . Member for Firisbury had spoken of the awful state of the country , but the Grovernmeht had not thought fit to put aside one night to discuss some measure for that relief . The Right Honi Baronet had premised to " give his pill when he had got his fee" —had he given those remedial measures ? The distress had increased

      progressively every month since the Hon . Baronet came into office ; , and it was their duty to take it into . consideration ; but he apprehended the session was too far advanced for that purpose . The manufacturers had contributed largely to the relief of the poor , for one had subscribed ^ 300 . The Hon ; Gentleman concluded a very eloquent speech by ah affecting appeal to the House in behalf of the poor people in the northern districts , now suffering the most appalling distress and privations . ;' Mr , Crawford ros « amidst loud cries of "Divide , divide . " He said there were large districts where the people werostarving . The poor houses had not the means of relieving the poor . A well-regulated poor law would give relief , but the present had not produced the effect . ¦ General Johnson supported the motion of the Hon Member for Finsbury . ( Divide divide . )

      Mb . Fielden moved an adjournment of the debate . After a few words from Mb . Febband , Col . Sjbthorpe and Mr Wakley , The House divided , when there appeared—For the adjournment , 29 ; Against it , 297 . The House resumed , when Sir . C . Napier moved an adjournment ofthe House Sir R . Peel said a great deal of time was lost in divisions ; but , if it suited the convenience of the House , he should propose that this question ( the Poor Law ) be adjourned till Monday next , which would necessarily cause the postponement of the new tariff . Mb . Duncombe said a few words in reply , and after a few observations from several Honourable Members , the debate was adjourned till Monday . On the third reading of the Railway Bill ,

      Sir H . Hardinge moved a clause providing that officers and soldiers travelling by railway shall with their baggage , &c , be conveyed at the usual hours of starting , at prices contracted for by the sscretary-atwar , on production of a note signed by the proper authorities . After some discussion the clause was agreed to , and the bill was passed . The Mines and Collieries Bill was brought up and received , with amendments . The other orders of the day were then disposed of , and the House adjourned , at a quarter past two o ' clock .

      onday , June 27 . Mr . Koebuck brought up a special report from the Election Compromises Committee , stating that Mr . Walter , who had been summoned , refused toattnd , and give evidence . The main ground on which Mr . Walter refused was , the expression used by Mr . Roebuck , during the last sssion ol Parliament , when on his being attacked in the Times , he had recommended the horsewhipping of Mr . Walter , its chief proprietor . The House ordered the attendance of Mr . Walter , and then some conversation arose on the subject of the inquiry before the Election Compromises Committee being conducted with closed d « ors .

      Mr . Roeuuck Btated that the committee had come to a unanimous resolution that the inquiry would be best conducted in that manner , though they did not dispute the right of any Member of the House being present . The proceedings were ordered to be printed v ? ith the votes for the use of members only . The adjourned debates on the Poor Law Amendment Bill was resumed by Mr . Fielden , who rose to answer the speeches of the Hon . Member for Bath ( Mr . Roebuck ) and the Right Hon . Baronet the Member for Tamworth . He would take that ef the Hon . Member for Bath first That Hon . Member bad spoken with great confidence on the surject of the Jjiew Poor Law , but in his ( Mr . Fielden ' s ) opinion with little sense . He ( Mr . Fielden )

      doubted the Hon . Member ' s experience of the labouring poor . He wanted ta know what means he had of knowing their habits , feelings , wants , and condition . Was the Hon . Member engaged in such occupations as would bring him necessarily in daily contact with labouring persons ? No ; be understood from the Hon . Member that he was a lawyer , and lie ( Mr . Fielden ) would not admit that a lawyer was , in the course , of hie occupation , brought into that relationship with the labouring poor that would give him the means of legislating in their case . He ( Mr . Fiolden ) claimed to be heard upon this question , because he felt confident that be did know much of the labouring people . He had been in business as a manufacturer ever since tke year 1803 , and be was so now . He and his partners had

      always employed great numbers of hands , and for some years past they had constantly in their employment some , thousands ; and , so long as he had a seat in that House , he would by speech and vote resist a law which was based upon the false and wicked assertion that the labouring people ef England , or any material part of them , were inclined to idleness and vice ; and he felt that he owed them too much to sit patiently by while this commission was proposed to be continued . He believed that the New Poor Law had been most oppressive , and that it was founded on the most fallacious principles . Tbe Hon . Member for Bath spoke first of the new law being both wise and humane , and he told the House that , being a lawyer , he wished to be answered by facts . As to the humanity of the law , he

      ( Mr . Fielden ) would give one fact , and he begged to be understood as giving one fact of many that he could produce . In 1830 there Jived in the parish of Eversbolt , in the Woburn Union , a widow of the name of Susan Deacon . She had been relieved by the parish before the Union was formed , but , as the new law came into operation , her allowance was reduced down as low as lsv a-week . In the night of the 25 th of December in that year that pbor woman threw herself into a moat in the garden of the rector of the paxiab , a guardian of tiie union . It -was a bitter cold night , and the weather frosty . Her body broke through the ice , and when taken out , it was found that she must have risen freiii her bed to drown herself , as she was dressed in her night clothes . The coroner ' s jury

      wished to return averdict , stating the circumstances that caused her to « lrown herself— that was ,, the refusal of the board of guardians to grant her the accustomed relief ; but the coroner persuaded them to return a verdict of insanity . The jury , however , immediately after , being touched with sympathy for a poor and Tespecfeed neighbour , signed and circulated this paper , of which he ( Mr . Fielden ) had a copy : —" -We , the undersigned jurymen on the body of Mrs . Deacon , of Hill ' s-end , Evershoit , who drowned herself in the Rev . J . Reed's moat , on last Monday morning , through distress of mind , in consequence of having been refused a shilling per week by the said J . Reed and the other guardians of the poor for Eversholt parish , have given bur verdict ; 'Ineane : ' and , out of compassion and respect to

      the deceased , ; in order to prevent her goods from being taken from her orphans to defray the funeral txpencea , have contributed 6 d . each towards bury ing her . The smallest contribution from any person who can feel for Buch a case will be most thankfully received by the jurymen . Should there be .. more collected tban will pay her funeral ejcpenceSi it will be given to her poor children . " He ( Mr . Fielden ) had offered to prove this eas « before tha Poor Law Committee , but was frustrated . Mr . Bail had attempted to get it before a committee ef the Lords , but he had also been frustrated . The paper , however , circulated by the jaryraen spoke for itself ; and . be ( Mr . Fielden ) adduced that one case as a specimen of the humanity of the new law . Thy Hon . Member then spoke of the

      " problem how to relieve the honest able-bodied without giving encouragement to idleness by relieving the idle vagabond . " He said that "the Reformed Parliament had looked this difficulty in the face , " and that "he wished it to be particularly shown how the difficulties of this question would be met , except by imposing such restrictions on the administration of relief as would make its reception not more agreeable : than the . ejcerciBe of honest industry . " He . ( Mr . Fielden ) maintained , first , that the Parliament had not met the difficulty in the face , but had created a board of threb commissioners to do so , or to do as they liked . The

      Parliament had proposed to it a bill abolishing outdoor relief after the 31 st of July , 1835 ; but It expunged that part of the bill , and left it to the commissioners to make the law . But , as the Hon . Member praised the law and the commissioners and their doings , he might be taken to approve of the prohibitory ordoi for stopping out-d » or relief to all able-bodied poor unless in the workhouse , and of the regulation * and Vita-, cipline which they had ordered to be observed In tho workhouses . The Hon . Member , in fact , approved of the workhouse test , the " self-acting test , " as tho com « missiohers called it , which was to sift the honest nml hard-working man from the idle vagabond . Let him ,

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      then , examine the practical operation of that test , for he < Mr . Fielden ) believed it to be a most atrocious cruelty on the honest and willing workman , and productive of infinite mischief to the country . He would take the two cases supposed by the Hon . Member himself . Here were two applicants for relief , both coming to the board of guardians at the same time ; both have families , both are able-bodied ; but one is an honest hard-working man , who cannot get work ; the other is an vagabond , Who will not work if he can help it . What does the board do ? It eould not give anything but the worihopse test and its discipline , itB separation , and its diet to both . It must give the same to both . Now would come the operation of sifting , and . the proof of the sound principle and

      prilosophy of the new Uw . Which of the two would go into the house ? If both go in , tben the law punishes the honest man just as it did the vagabond ; If the honest main went in , and the idle vagabond was driven to l / . aintain himself , then the honest mani only was punished . If the vagabond went in and submitted to the discipline of the workhonaelor the siake of idleness , then he would ask where did the honest and willing workman go ; to— the man who was admitted to be honest , the man who would do work if he could get it f He ( Mr . Fielden ) would ask whither had you driven that man ? He would tell them . In a table published by the comm i ssioners in the sixth annual report , there was a column containing the number of vagrants and paupers relieved not belonging toanyparish in theunion ,

      and it gave the numbers in Christmas quarter , 1838 , and in the same quarter , 1839 , from fourteen counties in England and Wales ; the total showed that in 1838 there were 1 , 705 vagrants or casual poor , and in 1839 no less than 3 , 111 , being an Increase of 1 , 406 , or 82 per cent . The admirable system bad driven the willing workman to become a wanderer in search of work ; and , failing in that , it had made him , whose virtue was confessed , a vagrant gathering alms in the quality of casual poor . Jhat was . the 'wisdom and the philosophy of this law . But it was the idle vagabond that the Hon . Member fer Bath wished to punish . Very well ; the . Hon . Member , being a lawyer , knew doubtless that there was the Vagrant Act in force when the

      New Poor Law was passed , and in force still , by which all vagabonds were amply punished . Aye , but that law would not meet the whole mass of the ablebodied . No ; nor should it . Another assertion of the Hon . Member for Bath was , that the outcry against the new law was not raised by the honest and industrious poor , but by self-interested persons of a dishonest sort , who had been destroyed by the operation of the new law ; He ( Mr . Fielden ) would now read to the House . a short paper that had been written by a labouring man of , he believed , the Diss Union , in Norfolk , and printed at the expence of one of the Guardians , and which had been sent to him . ( Mr . Fielden ) by a clergyman residing in the Union . It was as follows :-

      —" POOR LAW AMENDMENT ACT . i " Since the New Poor Law , the honest , indastriqua able-bodied poor are much oppressed , through the orders of the Poor Law Commissioners . It frequently happens from severity of the weather , that the farmer is unable to find employment ; the poor man , under such circumstances , ' having a large family , is rendered totally unab e to support them honestly ; and when he appeals to the Guardians , all the relief he can get is to leave his house and little furniture , and be made a prisoner in the Union Workhouse . I therefore think that the Board of

      Guardians ought to be empowered to relieve tbe poor man without forcing him from his bouse and home till the farmer may be enabled to employ him , and the weather will permit him to work . I , Thomas Cook , can prove that during the last two months I have lost half my time , therefore take the liberty to inform the public that the parishes of Bressinghara and Fersfleld intend to send a petition to Government , and earnestly hope that other parishes will do the same , praying that the industrious poor may be relieved without being sent to the werkhousft . . - :

      " Thohas Cock , "Labourer , Bressingbam , Feb . 9 , 1841 . " Now , he ( Mr . Fielden ) thought that simple statement not only proved that the Honourable Member % for Bath knew nothing of the feelings of the honest labouring poor on this question , but tbat he was wholly uninformed upon the subject on which be so confidently talked . He would now come to the speech of the Rifiht Hon . Bart , the member for Tam worth ,. who bad said tbat he thought the people of this country were in favour of the commissioners , because he found , that leaving out the petition of the 3 , 000 , 000 , there had been only 108 petitions that session against the commissioners , signed ' by 25 , 000 names , Nowi the fact was , according to the committee of petitions , that up to the 10 th of June there were that session 135 petitions

      against the new law and the bill before the house , containing ' , 344 signatures , and there had been many presented since , of which no report had been made . The petition of the 3 , 300 , 000 required a total alteration of the constitution of that House ; and it alleged , as one of its reasons for desiring the change , that the House as at present constituted had passed the unconstitutional New Poor Law , Was not that a pretty strong expression of public feeling against the commissioners ? The 3 , 300 , 000 not only desired to abolish the commissioners , but the Vary construction of the assembly which had made them ; But he would call the attention ofthe House to the number of petitions in former years , all in effect against ^ the New Poor Law , an immense majority for total repeal , and others for alterations which would defeat its principle .

      Years Petitions Persons . 3834 172 ... ~ 10 , 156 " 1835 ...... 16 ... ... 15 680 183 ( 5 119 27 , 574 1837 285 270 , 096 1838 ...... 346 ... ' ~ . 264 . 100 1839 136 ...... 30 , 000 1840 ... ... 190 ... ... 17 , 000 1841 ...... 895 ... ... 280 , 646 1842 ( to 10 th Jane ) 185 ... ... 36 , 344 To these should be added the two national petitions , the first with upwards of 1 , 250 ^ 000 signatures , and the second with 3 , 300 , 000 . Now , the petitions . in favour of the new law , or somewhat in favour of it , were— . : ¦ : ' ¦ ¦ - ' : ' , - . ; .

      Yeare . Petitions . Persona 1834 ... ... 2 16 183 ff . 0 ... ... 0 1836 0 ... ... . 0 1837 ... ... 35 950 183 8 ... ... 23 1 , 184 1839 0 0 1840 ^ 0 0 1841 ... ... 72 ... ... 467 1842 fto June 10 ] 0 ...... 0

      He thought that was an answer to the Right Hon . Baronet as to the pubic feeling on the whole of this law , and it was also an answer to the Right Hon . Home Secretary as to the direct remedy generally demanded upon the publication of the report of the Poor Law Commission of 1 nquiry in 183 4 . He wonld now go , to other parts of the Right Hon . Baronet ' s speech . He said , "Dp you speak of this bill as depriving the poor of any of the advantages which they enjoyed under the law of Elizabeth ?'' Yes , he did . The law ef Elizabeth made the overseers set the ablebodied poor on worki and it made them buy materials for the purpose . Under that law the overseers had no authority to imprison and separate them , man from wife , and parent from child , as a condition of civing them work

      that ¦ . The sva of George I . gave the overseers authority t 6 administer relief only in a workhouse . fixe S 6 th of George III . repealed this law , BtatiBg in its preamble that much hardship had been inflicted on poor persons by withholding relief unless they wonld go Into a wpTkhouae . Then came the New Poor Law , and the Parliament not being bold enough to re-enact the 9 th of- George I . enacts that Poor Law Commissioners shall have authority " to declare to what extent relief shall be given to able-bodied persons out of the workhouses , " and that they shall have power to make rules for the governing of those workhouses , which was , in fact , committing the able-bodied poor of tbii kingdom to the will of that Baard . He did say that that hsd deprived the poor bf advantages

      that they had under the 43 d of Elizabeth ; and , if the Right Hon . Baronet meant to ceatend that that the pew law was the same in principle as the A 3 dqf Elizabeth , let him remind the Right Hon . Gentleman that Lsrd Brougham , in bringing the new law into the House ' Of Lords , in 1834 , spoke ofthe 43 d of Elizabeth as that •• accurted law , " not a phrage likely to be used by one who was proposing a law similar ia principle . The Bight Hon . Baronet ha 4 referred to the mismanagement of the poor in the Keighley Union , taking the informaiiion of a Poor Law Commissioner , and he argued that the 8 e ' thingB could not be redressed if we hod not the commissioners . Bat had not the Right Hon . Baronet heard of worse things occurring under the Poor Law Commissioners themselves ? Had he never heard

      of the horrible deaths at Bridgewater ? Of the fatal gruel of the Commissioners ? And did not the Commissioners do everything in their pewer to stifle inquiry and hide the facts from the public ? What did they do at Sevenoaks , which was under the inspection ef one of their own assistants ? Remember the swollen throats of the children , the treatment of the lying-in womenT-a tale so harrowing and disgusting that one scarcely ; Ukedto dwell upon-the . detail , ' ' Then again Inquiry wai forced on the Commissioners , and the greatest attempts were made to stifle it Yet the Right Hon . Baronet appeared to look on the Commissioners a » a Board whose duty it was to drag to light and hold np to publio view the illtreatment of Uie poor whenever it migkt occur

      That was new ground—quite a new function ; but he quoted the Commissioners' reports from the ' Keighley Union , and asked how these things were to be brought to light but by the cbmmissieners ? His ( Mr . Fielden ' s ) answer was , the Bridgewater and Sevenpaks cases were brought to light , not by the commissioners , but in spite of them , and that if the commsssioa were abolished to-morrow , the same good feeling nn ( T natural abhorrence of cruelty which held » p Bridgewater and Sevenoaks to public gaxe would bring to light such cases as that of Keighley , snpposlrtR it , all to be true . Bat if the Right Hon . JJiirouet was very anxfpus that the cases of hardship 1 h managing the poor should be brought to light , weuid h < & nowinslst on bringing fully to light that which he ( Mr . Fieldenj believed ¦ would develops a ^ tale of folly ( CpnUnned in our Seventh Page . )

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      6 THE NORTHERN STAR . ________ 1 * . ™ - ¦ ^ - . - - - ^ -- —— - . ___ ; — : — - ' = » - —— ¦ ' — " ~ — ¦ ¦ - " — - ' - ¦ ' ¦ ¦ ¦ . " ¦ ¦ ¦; ... „ .. - ¦ ,.,. „ ., — .-. I ,, -- , ^—~— . . - i—K ^ m

  • Citation
    • Northern Star (1837-1852), July 2, 1842, page 6, in the Nineteenth-Century Serials Edition (2008; 2018) ncse-os.kdl.kcl.ac.uk/periodicals/ns/issues/vm2-ncseproduct895/page/6/