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Northern Star (1837-1852), 8th April 1843, Edition 4 of 4, Page 8, Leeds ;—Printed for tha Proprietor PEARG? S

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      Untitled Article

      MR . DUSCOiLBE'S MOTION . ( Cmrfinued fxom out Seventh page ) God , and reason , hare condemned this inequality . " Here tbe inequality poinied out was tint ¦ p-hi&Ji existed bsitvs-. ii ifcuse who laboured Sc-J ihese wio paid for labour . —( hear , bear , fcfcar , h ; s ? ) He conld assure the Hons = he did not meaa tofcee-pback anything that mic'hs be material hi favour of there parties . Tne zroclsaiation wen : 03 : — " XatUK , Gtfd , and reason have condemned this inpqnslity , ani ia ihe tHnnd-r 3 or' a people ' s T > i- * e it must perish fcr e ^ er . He- knows thai labour , the real property of secHy , th ? sole origin of acca-2 nslaied progeny , : he firs : caa > e of all national Tveahh , and the only supporter , defender , ami cont

      tribuor lo the greataess of our coin-try , is not pails' -ss--d of lie same legal protec lea which fa given to ttu .-e lifeless fcffeais , tie bonnes , ships , and machinery - ^ hieh labour nave alon e created . He knows tfaa " if labour tes no protection * -prases cobnut be uplJ . i , jiw ia the sligh ' esi degree regu l ated , nnfil every H-orkmaa of tw-s y-oce yea ? s of age and of sane TE ' -xi jt- 02 the same political level as the employer . Us knows that the Charter would rem-ve , by uni-T- rMl will expressed in UuiveTfal Suffrage , the Lr-avy load of tax * s ¦ which now cm-h vhe es . stenc of ih-- > labourer , and cripple the efforts o' comsHTc-i , iha : i " . TT- ? ald gire cheap £ 0 Teramem as well jis cbi-ap food , huh wa ^ es , as well as low taxts , bring happiness to the hearthstone , plenty to the table ,

      pri-tcctiou to the old , education to the yovais . . prrniit ; prs ^ p-Tlfy t 5 ihe country , lovg-cuniiuaed proWSWe po ! ; sal power to labunr , and p . ace , ole ^ -d pea <^ to ; n-j . spproving nations ; therefore it is that tsv haf - i-olemaly sworn , and one and all declared , that tae ^ o ? dtn opporicnily now fviiiiin ear ^ rasp shall H *> ' ^ 333 a ? rav fruitless , li ^ st the chance of c = n : urjrs St . 2 . e < i to bs t » 5 a wi ^ e and all-s ^ ing God , shaii eoi re lost ; but , thai we do now UuiTeiKi'h resolve never to resume labour un : il labour ' s grn' 7 ar ; c ? s are desuojed , and pro ;« enon 5 > eenred for bursvlvi . ? , oar suS * usu wives , and helpless ehiHmi , by 'he enacc-3 S-.-U ? of the People ' s Charter . " This was pat fonh Vu xie" "woil 1 n ; -a lime when it Wi 5 proved bj

      evidence that iheTe were thousands iu not less loan fifty , aji ? . i hundred parts of the eouuiry-, seek ^ n " , by thr j' ? , by iariiaJdati- n and riokace , to e'op the op ^ r-dras of labour . Evidence won'd be shown to ih ^ m , from trhicfc they mijjh ; jud ^ e what was the object of tbose panics when this Terr piper was published by ihe Charts's tiei .- ^ ves . T ; e next pag ? a ^ e referred to the Ilo "J ? bed at Preston . It said farther—** CGuntry-3 z u sue broibers , 4 ^ iituries may roll on ss they hare 3 e -d past , be : ort such nnivercal action msy asam be -r - jiayed ; w ; nave made the ea ? t for-librriy , 2 . nc . v- « i mas : sta-. d , like jnen . the hazi ; J of the die . " A 3 ! ; a < £ ; it was to be observed , was addressed to men ae- - ublvd iatnoti ^ a ' » ia ~( heaT , hear . ) ll proceedfd

      — Lei scne de-pond . Let all o- ~ cool ar-d wat ^ -r . lnl , ai > c , IJj ^ ihf bridta . a > d 5 in the parabie , i-ep your lac ; ,- ; horsing , aad *• t yosir conu-uod rasoiauou be b&c 2 I > jacon "lo guide thoir w ^ o are uc- w has : eKing f :. ' - -nd svide to follow jour memorable example . Brvtirta , we rely upon your firaiue ? s ; cowardiee , trcacaery ^ or womanly fear would ca-i cur cau-e l > ac » for half a centnry . Let no t £ an , woman , or cbili break uowa . £ he solemn pledge , and it tk-ey do JE 2 J : a ? enr ^ of ujs poor and the starring pu rg-ae tteui—ibev c-e ^ = rr . siarery who would madlj cour " . iz . Uur m ^ cbinerj is all arrauseu . " What , be a ? sed , iris ihe nv :-aning of tha ; ! 1 : commurd , u maciansry i- all arranged , and your caase wi >] in irxeedays be irape'led onward bv ail lie intellect

      We can stunnua to its aid ; therefor . % k . t . ^ s : yon are p ^ -actinl befina ; wbiisiyoa areordtsrlv ni-fee al ! be so ] 'k- - ^ vi ^ e ; and wmLst you iook to the iaw , remember tha ; yonibad no Vjiee in making it , and ar « , therefore , the siaT' ^ s to the will , ibe law , and the caprice oi yotir m&siers ^ And in a pas ? s £ * which he had p ^ -5 i ^ l over , he found tLis tz . przssr . iy > : : u Peace la «" . and order , cave prevailed on cur = ac-e f * rhatis , thy bai ? toppfJ the entile labour oi men—ihey hia stopped it , noi by ap ^ -ealm ^ to men ' s will or iiiclinar . oa , bo ; to their fears , and thtn to violence tv ^ . en iii 3 y decliiisd to comply ¦ nith the d > msnds TL ^ ce on iIjmq . Tie prociamaiion { -aid .- ** Be Srin , 3 > 5 eonriHCons , he Tarn . Peace , iaw , and order hav ? prevailed on car iade—lei them be revered , until

      your brethren in s > eotland , Wales , ana Ireland are informed of y ^ nr Tt-solution ; and when a universal holiday pn / va ; is , which will be the case in eight days , then of what use will bayonets be against public opaion J" Kow , he would ask ihe Bonm , he would S £ k either sde of the lionse , for this wis not a < ja-. s tion of pany , but it was a question of ? he public safciy—( shters . ) It was a qacstion whether the instiianons of tba coniury were to be permanent , or to be pro 5 traied by miseheivous machinatioiiS of this description —( h » ar , bear . ) One sentence more , and he had done wi ; h thisadcress . Is was'this : — " n \\ i&isers of the a ^ sociMioi ! are called upoa to aid and . asfisD in the peaceful exwe-ion of the mov e ment , and w > forward all moneys for the u : ~

      of ihe delegates who may be expressed over the c * n £ ~ ry . Strengthen our iands a » th ^ s crisis . Sapp-orr yoar leaders . Mally round cur sacred cas-- ^ -, & 22 2 aas"e the deeisiou to ibe God of Justice and yf Battle . " He would ask any Member of iha : Ht-n-e—& 6 w ^ nid a ? k the Hon . ilemn = r Uc ^ If- if , in the d starbsd ? taie in whieh Laccashm-. Lhesh > re , and Stafiordshire were at that moraent , h « wouid pu : hi ? hans to a document bke that— ( hear ) ? Wr . a iris the coD 5 tmcioa whica any fair ai . d caniid mi . a froiT i ; -iis xtpoa 21 —{_ ear , hear ) ? Uut t * i £ Ho- 'lre "Wi < iiaiaiy 5 et in the possession of all the fac » > , "KhicD would ecatle it to come to a just j'jd ^ mcci with respsct to tiiese cases . He parucnlarly reqi -sted their attention to ibis resolution , which the

      d ' -egai s had come 1-0 on the 18 : h . 1 ; was- jo this eff ct : — K-. s » Ted , That we , the aei ^ gates , in public rnsBthm asseiabicd , do Tt-coaxnf-ad to the "Var ious isoiistmeacks which we repr . acut , to a 4 opl all legal means to carry into effect the pe « ple ' 3 Charier . Ajid further , we recommend that delegates ba sent thrcush the whol ^ of ihe country , 10 esdeavon ? 10 obtain the co opgra : ion of -. he nuddie and working classes , in carrying ou : ti-e resolution of c ? s -icg l ^ our until the Cbarter be madt the law of the land . " What , too , he as ££ d , was the meaning of thai ! He had no doubt , as vn what was the real history t > f the aadr-ss and reso ' . nt-ons of the Cnanist del ^ ates- He t hought so iai from having a doubt of it , that ii had been icace » Bjaiicr oi

      esidence . They c&mft not to ^ laact .. = iti ior tie pnTposeofrarmnglhesirjie to thtraccoant of the Charur . They came to Manchester foran entire . 5 lufikrent purpose . But when they tame there , v ^ in !; what was ths state of the public feeing , they . , ¦ . * t that there wasafibrdectoihema ** glorioiii ^ oj t ! -:. < . pp-.-rrBii ' . tj . " Tae 5 conceived u tig ' &t , for J ^ tu p .. ! >>•¦> - * - «¦ , to take advantage ; and accordicg-y . a ? th . y .- j . . put u for ¦ Brard in thar placard , if ail Wa ] t . -, Scotland , and Irelard , had followed the exacpk wj , ch was set by Lancaster , the effec ; would be a -pceraJ confusion in the country . There was . joo , in aid of Eucb . an obieet , a placard i ^ sied of xuis descnpii on —** Rim tor gold—aabonr—^ labour is suspendedpublic credit is gone—paper is worthies ^—every

      sovereign is now worth shiny shillbiis—run , middle classes—ran for gold . " B « s believtd inat their impression was , that if this siate of rhirnjs conld bt got to spread from county to count ) , ibey wonld Eccceed iu carrying ? he Charter . H ; < ii 3 not compla ^ nj although it had bfcen improperly i , = 7 . pdUd to tim ,-of any man , whatever nj ^ ct be hi- up-. aions , vrho sought to maintain ihein p aceabij—i , e did noi make it a maker of re . ~ > rc 2 . ch to any vne , who upheld the doctrine liar Uoirer-ai Sitffr .-jie wonid be a better moce of adja ; niiieriiig the ; , fiWs of ihe country than uiid r the pre * tat coE-- ! iaaon . He btsged Dbi to mis . himst-lf up , as a repre > entative of the Crown , with the qnesiion ^ f the Luzsirr t orth ? AcB-Corn Law Leasce- He couid ^ . t this to the

      Kononrabls ; Member tor F ; u-bury , t ) . a . t if he wonid fm-isirfi Mm vdih thr e vIoeEce to aho ^ ; hat any persons were coc ~ wr : ug togeilier to ad a pubi : c mischief , he should in-mediat-ly fctl iv < o be hib dmy Jo S& 6 , Srst , wLetiier thai which was imputed was 3 crime , and next whether ii eonltl be brought home to thtm —( bear , bear ) . All oe had dobt was this—yrzere erime was impuied , it was iair-y statedasdibliy pror ^ d , and when 11 could noibetu . l'V proved , iho pTostcu :: oD wsts abandont-i . lie mijcju now call the attention of the House to the axicrL » of tiedelefeaie 3 whieii had sppt-ared in the Northern Star © f Saturday , Au-n-st 20 . There had been iorij dcleg 2 d . es assuinoied , atd rery nesrij eTcrv out of tbcin spoke , the TijtuLukn btiDg tfca \ no one wa-.

      to c ;> e 3 i more thin fiv * minstcs —( laoch ^ r);— iirt he wcal-i aaviberhe Hun . Member in h ^> r .-p . y jh-: to take np mure thau two minutes . Tn- y ba-i a .-honhajid W 2 iicr presciu , who supplied 'mm « nh an account of the tpertbts that wei- k : » -t . > it >* y he t * rg ^ t& ssj xha : in the pocket of i ? io k , one of th « - priBoEfcrs—and bt wis-hed to call ; be atte :. tion oi Hon . Xtetabo-5 10 this fact—in hit pod n was fwu , d a = aort nuu-cf ; ne d = bate—it was Jik , a i .-iiirzn © - moraudum of wha 5 had passed , aiyd it , in ctctt Tfc 5 p £ c :, «> re oui iiie stajement of wt , ai , ^ ri . tP =,, iii ' e Hon . ileniuer would call ti » e ren-g- ^ de" Montana TFTiter . He would tell the Hon . te ^ oet thai 'hat F ^ Lr ^ V ^ " \ sp 5 ' " h ^ " ^ otthe bv-vernm ^ twho had sent him item ¦ but he afteiwards Tulan ^ ercd and ei ^ re-sed z d « lre j « give information . He , for one , had noi the i-ligutest objecaon" to receive the statement of such a personhe Biig h * hare broken faith with ibest with wh"m iaith ght to be

      Do ^ B kept —( hear , hear , from Mr Buncombe . ) He said that if parsons met together for iae purposes of treason , or what waa approaching to treason , and thai ihote -who joined with them were io regard themselves * a bounil bj moial f « dings , ox th » DO 3 ense of . public caty—no feeling as to lift pnMic d&nger— -vns » induce them -to itp&ir the wrong they h * d been once willing to do , and to aake to compensation for thtir guili , then he said , if such a ' xv&ermxe hud down there woui < t bt no safety for Boeiety ^ wliere . BOch . conspiracies exirted , and such Onla ^ fiCEjBBB } binadons wtj-e to be foQGd —{ hear ) , — Tbig sb ^ li ^ nd miter - was confirmed b ^ Brooks &s toi 2 ie : § gsieh of Cooper , and that ho was sorry to be obliged jo ^ cefcr to , a& the man was now on his trial ; b $ S it ^ as es&iatiai that the Hguss diould Jcaow vl > y jmst ^ filial speech , what tnc parrife 3 meant s -ojr ia 3 ** 3 Bnesa , for that ppcesh left it no longer as & * slaaz £ of d ^ dbi , n ^ i evcu oi > n rnn ? e

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      much Jess of snspicion . Cooper appealed to God that the time was come when the pgople ought to be represented—that now the people sfconld be prepared to fight , and he was prepared to fighl , be the dang * r what it might , and the consequences to himself what they conld be . ( Hear , hear- ) Men who wtc on their trial were present / when that scene recurred , and when Cooper made that statement , and no one turned him out of the meeting—no one denounced him . He believed that he had been cr « ered—that his spirit had been praised , as wall as the manliness of his declaration , and on the

      fcUcwing day the placard ^ which he had read for them , was posted all over Manchester , and not less than seventeen different mobs were endeavouring to carry the Charter and make it the law of the land . He had next to refer to an address , which appeared in the paper belonging to the body—to the Northern Star of the 20 : h of August . Tais address observed that that strike , which was intended to effect a , repvai of the Corn Law , had bepn made to sustain the Charter , and it concluded by counselling these er-jaued in-the strike in abstaining from all destruction of life and property . He admitted that there had been a verv remarkable abstinence from

      the wanton injury of property , and the wanton attack upon life It was not the first time tha , t he had < jone homage to the tpirit that prevailed at that turn . —it wa < not characterised by violence ; but thtn it wss ius duty , aiso , to show what were the infenri : as of the parlies . They said , " we will have the Charur ; »^ e ruean to go frcm town to town , and fr -a > mill to mill , to tura out their workmen ; and ii uicj do zioi coma t-ut , then we wil ] make them . " It m- ^ ht jndrwi ba sa-d , ns it was said by the dcfendai ' j * and their counsel on their behalf , that all ti < y meant to do , whilst they preserved property and 2 b .- -utined from an attack on life , that p-. aceab : y they might have a teneral suspension of labour , aud ! ha : such wonid have the desired effect . And

      jet thi > se who said this had published paragraphs , tt-h ' . ch showed that he had put a just construction on their conduct . Und < -r the head of Chorley , it was in . ationed tnat 8 , 000 men had entered the town , and succeeded in stopping all the work in two houfs , that a great number had gone to Preston , aKd stepped all the mills—that in Baigley , several thousands had siopped all the mills , without any diffiiolij , there being no protective force ; that every thing was quite at a stand-still , and nothing was to be seen but the families of ih < j unemployed vr-- > rkn 2 i = i ! going through iJie streets . Similar s 4 atemeaii were made from Stafford , Manchester , Dewsbu y , Halifax , Leeds , Huddersfield , and oiher p aces ; in these places , where there was no protective

      * o"oe to guard the mill-owners , everything was obliged to yield to the demands of the uwb . Under these circuin nances , he asked , was il possible for them t-o doubt , but that the persons enSBged in th » -s 3 violent proceedings wtre doing that which was is ixhvng Jiortof high treason—( hear ) If the conduct of th ^ s ^ men did not amount to high tn-s 5 . m , hv was unaware of the proper meaning Gf th > - term . They were engaged in a sreat combination , a combination carried on by means of intinvLdation and violence . They went from place to pbe ? intending , bv that intimidation , force , and violvuce , to produce j ; res . t cliai ges in the laws and CA >*\ sli . uiion of tbe country . Such conduct did amount to usa ^ n—( hear ,-he » r . ) But vrhat was the

      course taken bj tbe government I It was , in the first instance , to institute i ? quiri < r 3 , and wh ^ re individuals were found actively engaged in these combinations , to 3 rrest th ^ m . In ihe firss place there was arre *» ed Leach , and afterwards Turner , the printer of the placard which he had referred to , and the p ^ r ^ n at whose house the address of the executive council had b > n corrected . Could they have been passed by ? if the prosecution had be >; n for high treason , Leach must have been arrested . - * nd he must refer much of the apparent severity of the magistrates to an impression very generally &v-oa'i iaa ; tin * offence v > hich had been committtd washigh treason , and that it was likely that s » vernment would dc-al wiih it a 3 mch . But government

      drtennmed otherwise . T .-ity thought that it would be better to adopt » he most m'll and moderate course—to sai := fv those p ^ r » ons who were minded to obey the law f : at they shonld be protected by the law , and , as far es possible , to assure those who bad broken the law t ' aar they were liable to punishment , and that s <> oie of them , at all events , should not eseape—( .: ar , hear ) . With respect to tbe conduct pursued xovratds Leach , he had been astonished to hear the S ' altment-- of the Hoa . Gentleman oppo-ite . The U"U . Gentleman had said that , whether that man ' s conduct was lliegsl or not , there was no evidence to prove it ; and , finally , that the charge had bem abandoned against him : and Leach himself stated " Tea your petiticner appeared at Liverpool , whrn

      the first charge upon which your petitioner was arrested was to be tried , and after svifFcrvrg thirteen c-t ys ' confinement und » r the xsircumstanoe-s mentioned the indictment against youT petitioner was abandoned , aud , a ^ hu believes , from a knowledge the erosfccutor had that hia witnesses were most grossly and foully perjured , and that your pelidoaer had amt > le xaeans to pro ^ e them so . " ii- < the Attoraey-GeEBral ) did not know whether the witness- , s baa been p » ijurcd 01 not , but he kntw this , that m Liverpoul ihe indictment wjs fvund upon which Leach appeared at Lancaster and so lar frr-m the charge having been abandoned , he was ci » nTj . n « i on tbe clearest evieenco . Ii was admnifd b \ h ;» a ?* -l' tiiiil the placard had h

      b < en * -tui-k up on his house . It was alsn . proT < . < J thai il wjt > ath . stanse that M'Douail ha < i crrtctcd toe pioof waen the placard was printed ; and it w ^ eJ = o proved by one of the books , respecting tho taking sway of which a gpec > al complain 1 - was tnado , i £ 2 i Leach was one of the members oi the Executive (" ouacsl—( hear , hear . ) He was sorry to detain the Hou ^ e so lona with these details , but the Honourable 3 d » mber for Finsburyhad madespeciaJ complaints with reference to the treatment experienced by the petitioners . First there was White , who had been convicted before Mr . Baron Gurnry , He was the first peit-on named in ice motion . Then there was B .-ook who was convicted at Lancaster , aud who was proved to have bad in his possession the

      minuted of the meeting of the Chartist delegates . , Next came Leach , a member of the Executive Committee , ai , d chairman of that body—then Harn ^ y , one of the delegates , who had been al-o j convicted . Tiiere were alia Brown and Robinson , and Allinson , who had been identified as the chair-: man of a Cnarii-t meeting—these were ail tbe per- ' sons he had to do with . He misht mention here that the paper of resoluuons of delegates which he ' had read , was signed by Haxney at tho bottom . But to continue—these pt , Rons were all who had been conricteJ , and sentence had not yet been passed . Thty were to appear on the first day of the terra to ' receive the judgment of ihe Court of Queen ' s Bench j for tbe offences of which they had been found guiky . > , j : ' ' j >

      And this was the time which the Hon . Member i for Pinsbury selected for making a charge agaia « t J the magistrates who had committed thtss men . It j would be safer for ifee public peace , and much j better for the offenders themselves—it would be i much more constitutional , and in accordance with the discreet exercise of the undoubted powers of this House , if the motion for irquiry had ] been postponed until it had appeared in 1 wnat way the Judge and Jury deliberating ' upon it had decided Cooper ' s case , and al < -o until ifce : Court of Queeu ' s Bench had disposed of the persons awaiting us se&Unee— ( hear , hear ? . DuGer these Circumstances , La must say that , having ihe &eanu or showing that lae tStuct ; was actually commuted \ I j «

      —an o-ffenee which did appear to him lo be one of the most high and the most grave ol" any known to the law—he must say that he was rot surprised at ; De severity of the interferei . ee complained of as having been exercised by the magistrates . So iar as he kutw , these gtntiemea had done no more man was their strict and absolute dnty under the peculiar and p&iniui circumstances in which ih « y wore plac-. a —( tear , hear ) . He tnought it bnt righi to nieution one tbuig more : so far from the pariies complaining having been dealt with with extraordinary severity ot the part of Government , he wsb noi eure but thai personal complaint oughi to be nu < l >) against himfeclf for the part which he bad taken in tho trials , that that complaint might be really made agaius-t him

      on ihe pari of those whom he represeatvd there , us having scarcely exhibited that fle ^ i * ee of fceverhy wLicit in = neh eases it was proper 10 eniorce . He assured the House that ho maae this stat « uieni ; wiih rgiaciiiBCe ; but the facts Were theee : —It .- 'ppeared lo him of the greatest importance that , having ftund ony tigh ? delegates exciting and urging the Wvrkinj ; men to continue their unlawful proce--dings , to persevere in a course of violence and iijtimiiiatioD - » did , be repeated , appear to him that 11 was proper i ' &at ihty aud the puulic should know that those who &dnsea cnaie , when that crime was executed , should be put on a similar footing with its perpetrators ; ana it therefore seemed to him to be necesfaoy to incict those parties—she advh > er 3 and the

      perpetrators together—10 show that after the commitment ot the crime the former were amenable io its consequences , and liable to the same indictment under vihich the actual perpetrators wtr& charged . But in adopting that course he was necessarily competed to abateun—&ad he did it with reluctancethe charges made separately against the leaders of these miBguided men—chargts , which , if proved , would haTe subjected them to far more severe punishment than uid those upon which they were actually tried . The offence which they had actually been convicted of was conspiracy , an offence punishable by fine or imprisonment , bat by nothing more . iso such modes of extra punishment as the treadmill

      coald be resorted to in such cases ; but whilst he W » a prosecuting individuals , many of whom occupied stations of considerable respectability—for he admitted the respectability of Scholefield , who had a chapel ; Leech , who "Wns a bookseller , Turner , the primer , and some oihers—le ibcogbt it right , while prosecuting these men , to put ifaeir names into ihe saiLe irdictment as that ncder which was ranked the names of the working men , to give them all a common trial and a common fate , and thus , bo far from being exposed to a greater degree of harsh ness by this mode of proceeding , the efftct of it was that the indictment was cajried by writ of ceruoim \ to th- Cosui oi Qut-tii ' s JBrrch , ana that the

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      prisoners were thus liberated from prison , in order to enable them to appear , and that all reoogni zances were immediately at an end . At this moment the parties in question were under , no recognizance to appear before the Court of Queen ' s Bench—( hear , hear ) . Could suoh a course be Bpoken of as a harsh one— ( hear , hoar ) ? Or , what right had the parties to complain , -when , detected in the commission of an offence of the gravest aspect —of one which threatened the maintenance of the public peace , they had yet , instead of being indicted for high treason , been only tried for the minor offence of creating unlawful combinations and assemblies ? yet , forsooth , these men , when it was thought necessary 10 bring them to trial , were 10 turn round and eay , as Turner did , " You have already l « t me off ; you have declared that the publication of the placard was no offence at all ; " or as another man had said , " Why , you only try me for conspiracy

      st last . " Yes , it was true they were oiily tried for conspiracy ; but the crime of which they were guilty was that of high treason . —( Hear , hear . ) He thought that there was no foundation for tho motion , so far as he was able to appreciate tho grounds on which it was made ; and lie must say , in tha language of the Noble Lord , the Member for the City of London , that without in the slightest degree questioning the power of the House to institute an inquiry Jike the one sought for , and to make the most searching inquisition into the misconduct and bad motives— if there existed misconduct and bad motives—on the part of any Government— yet that for the House to accede to the motion before them would be to encourage all those who were banded together to violate the Lw , aud afford the greate&t discouragement to all tho ^ e who Were dtaposod to admit its sway , and join in paying to it a quititani peaceable obedience . —( hear , bear . )

      Mr . PaKisgton called the attention of the Houso to the statement of the Honourable Gentleman oppo .-oto with reference to the magistrates of Dudley . The Honourable Go&tleman , in talking oi Mr . Badger and Mr . Cartwriglit had Stated that they had been guilty of conspiring with the Lord-Lieutenant , against tho liberties of tiie people , and that they were therefore unfit to . % old tbe commission of ihe pea ^ e . Now , he would eay , that he knew no gentlemen inoro fit in every respect to hold the commission of the peace , or rcore fitted n every respect to do their duty with propriety and advantage than the gentlemen aV . uded 10 . What

      had been the natuTe of the chargo against them In point of strict law , thiy w « -ro certainly guilty in refus ng bail upon the # rouud on which they accepted it . But the persons aggrieved had apppAled to law—they had applied to the Court of Qavcn ' s Bench for a criminal information against the nia ^ isi ra es , and what was the result ! Tho Honourable Member for Fmsbury had already moved for aud obtained the papers connected with tho case . He ( Mr . PakingionJ had a copy tof the judgment pronounced , and ho wouM read a passage bearing upou the subject before tho House : — " The complaint is not that workmen assembled to d' vise meaiiS to

      bettering their condition , but that others tuok advaataKe of their quarrels wiih their masters , and finanig vast numbers unemployed , ignorant and deflected , poujiht to incite them to every Kind of outrage . Not ina : the discussion of public Rrievances had beeu intemperately conducted , but that tumuUuous assemblies rendering all di-cutsion impo .-sibie , led to speeches and conduct which must havo beeu expected to lead to " violence , outrages , outbreaks , coi . iiicts with ine lawful authorities , almost t ^ rtaiuly to bloodshed , and very probably to universal pillage . Whether or not these meeting having been held in the immediate neighbourhood of Dudlf y is of small importance ; they had botm held in other quarters , producing their natural resulis , and were rapidly

      extending . It is sworn that near Dudley , in a popu-3 a tion of half a uiiliion , porsons wtre expecting to follow this example , and in this state of things the meeting in question was announced . It was observed on the argument , that few deeds of violence were actually committed in that district , and those by no meanB of a formidable character : if that bo eo , we have no doubt , when w , regard the materials and tbe instruments of midchief that were preparing , that that circumstance is to be ascribed to ihe vigilance , tho spirii , and real humanity with which the magistrates enforced the law , as her Majesty's proclamation enjoined them . We think they are entitled to the gratitude of their Sovereign and tbe country for thoir conduct , and we

      are of opinion that they would havo deserted their duty if they had not committed O'Neill for trial for the part he was proved to have takt n at the meeting , which they most properly disported on the 20 i-h of August . " Tne Hon . Gentleman continued—Yet in spite of all this tbe Hon . Gentleman opposite said that the magistrates should be dismissed from tho commission . He was awaro that an error had bscu committed by them , but the opinion which had led them to commit it , they honottly entertained , and if they did entertain a doubt ou the stringency of the law on the subject , there were good grounds for making them believe that under cxiblinj ; circumstancesin tbe peculiar position of the country at tne tiraoth ? y were consulting the public safety by not taking

      bail from per-ons connected with thobe who were agitating and disiurb . ng the couutry . The application to the Court of Queen's Bench , was dismissed , on the tTotiod thai although the ms ^ is , - tra ' es had committed a lefcal error , > ct that a , t ihe time they had no i < iva of perpcruling any injustice —( hear , hear ) . As sooii as it became known , in the district to which thess genikmun belonged , that the Hon . Member tor Fiusbury intended to come btfore the Hou-e of Commons with a complaint relative to their conduct , a public meeting was held , aud he held iu his hand a copy of the address voted at that meeting to Messrs . Cartwriglit and Badger . The Hon . Member proceeded to read the address . It acknovsli-dged the deep and lasting sense of obligation felt by t ! . e meeiiiig to the niagi&trate . s to the military aiid yeomanry , and stated that the preservation 0 / tl . e life and property of those gi ^ nin ^ the document was mainly attributable to their ixeruony .

      H > need only add that this address was bigned by 135 of the most respectable bankers anu mercliants of ihe town of Dudley , and at the head of the list ke observed the name of Lord Ward—( hear , besr ) He himsc'f had been present at many ot the conferences held between the magistrates and the Lord Lieutenant of the county , and had never witnessed more temporasoe , combined with juuicious firmne&s , than be had seen manifested upon those occasions—( hear ) . This was not , he beJit-Ted , the first occasiou on which the Honourable Gentleman opposite had been unlucky in thu selection of a course to be adopted . It was a very poor return to men who had , in a great crisis , discharged their duties with zeal and with great aotivily —it was a poor return to such men , for a Member of the House of Commons to stand up and attempt to hold them up to pubiio ecorn , and to reproach them for conduct for which they were wtll entitled to public gratitude—( cheers . )

      Mr . Fiklden was almost inaudible for several sentences , and was very imperfectly heard throughout . He wa 3 understood to reprobate the conduot of the Dudley Magistrates in refusing to take bail—a degree of siyerity whicbfcadgiveu an impression to ihe public mind that the pe ^ oas aggrieved had been most unfairly treated . He bad heard it alleged that the Government had treated the rioters with leniency , but surely that was no argument for ihe magistrates being allowed to Irtat tbilD with a degree of seventy for which there was no necessity . What were the circnmstanct » i under which the

      disturbances broke oui ? Their petitionsand remonstrances to iho House had long been treated with contemptthe HouiC which ought to have protected them would do nothing for thorn . They considered themselves aggr ifyed ai . d BPglected . Ti-o Attorney-Gtntral had stated that tlie moverunii bad not originated with the C-harlis ' . s . It was at first a question of wagta and of work . Many were out of employmeut , and those who were in work were labouring at such reduced wages that starvation was storing them in the face There was one case brought before the House which was of a peculiarly distressisg nature . ( We understood the Hon . Member to refer to tho case of White . ) Was this proper treatment of a man , who , as he had no bad intention , ou ^ ht to have been put down with

      all possible humanity ? And after all , continued he , what has been the conduct of these men , thai they should be bo unequivocally condimned % What is the grand object for which they combined ? To obtain a voice . n the making of the Jaws—( hear . ) 1 have been a great many movements in my days for the purpose of obtaining some share in the government of ihe country , aud ihe men who joined in and led them used language just as « . xcuiDg as any imputed to ihcse men . Ana these , bo it always recollected , were working men . What does Leach say ? This , let , me observe , was a mm of excellent character . 1 never heard a word 10 his disparagement . He is a Chtiitist , it is true , aud as such must be called and treated as a criminal . But what is his defence 1

      "Weare charged , " said he , '' with wishing to destroy machinery . Why should we destroy the work of our own hancs ! But this much 1 maintain—that it is our duty to take care that machinery does not destroy us . " In fact , he maintained nothing more than that it was necessary 10 shorten the hours of factory labour , so as to make it compatible with the life and comforts of the working people—so as to enable their children to receive that education which you now so loudly urge on Parliament as essential to tho salvation of the country —( hear , hear . ) How could you expect anything eke but some civil convulsion , when you invariably

      denied all redress of the grievances of the people , and then crowned your humane consideration for their wants by passing tho sew Poor Law 1 If you had never passed that law , we should never have heard of an outbreak in Ihe North . Is it not preposterous to deny the working men all legitimate means of obtaining relief , and , when they furiously break out into acts of insubordination , to justify the conduct of magistrr tes , which , in my opinion , was clearly unjustifiable 1 I was myself a witness of some of these proceedings . A large multitude of these working men came over to the works of myself and brothers . Bui before thc-y arrived , Mr . Taylor , Mr . Crobdry . ai ; d an tfficer ci dragoons , came to me

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      and assured me that if we wanted protection it should be afford . Those gentlemen said the mob was coming to pull out the plugs and stop our works . The leader soon cam * up , as was the case in so many other places . I asked , " whai is it you want ? " The reply was " we want twolvo hours' wages for ten hours' work . " I said , "I am ready to agree to that . " I then assured the Magistrates and officers that these men only wanted a reasonable change , which I was willing to concede ; and that as for tho protection of my works , if my people were not able to preserve them , I should never appeal to the Magistrates aud military . Well , they went through the vale and stopped the mills ; but not a single offence did they commit against life , and not a single injury did they

      commit against property . When they arrived at Halifax , however , they met the troops , and then ensued th * 6 heart-rending scene which has been described . Why , it is notorious in Halifax that the representation which my Hon . Friend has given is true . No person doubts the fact of the man bung .-hot in the manner described . And such severity as this is attempted to be defended , instead of your calming tho public miud by assuring the people that you will listen to their complaints , and use your utmost efforts to redress them . I think it wouM be a much better course if tho Ilouso endeavoured , by the appointment of a Commit'ee or some other means , to ascertain whether the people had not reason to complain , and pledged itself to th' : most strenuous efforts to remove tho evils which afflict the great mas-s of ih <> community . But if the people are to bo left in tueir present condition , and to bo treated in the mauner which they havo been , 1 t-ay thon you must

      prepare for another insurrection , as the time is not far distant when the people mu ^ t . be a ^ ain drirca to violunce . The labouring people mut-t ba supported . They must live by their labour , or you must supply them with tho means of subsistence—( hear , hear . ) It is an old saying that " hunger will break through stone walls ; " and though you may trample on a hungry people ouco or twice , at last , you will find their power too great for you . I should recommend this Hous ^ e , then , not to uelay turning us attention to the real state of the workiug classes , and doing something to remove tho prejudices which prevail in their minds against the governing power . Depend upou it no decision oi this House can put down the organ i zation whiflh iias been formed for tho obtaining of Uuive ^ al Suffrage , Annual Parliaments , and the Vyio by Ballot . Ho thoug ht , the people out . 'ht to persist iu their demands . He would support tho motion with much pleasure .

      Mr . W . Patten defended the Magistrates , and thought the motion unsubstantiated . Lord Francis Egerton then rose to defend his own conduct in the matter of the Preston butchery . Of course he was quite sure that it was absolutely necessary for the soldiers to fire upon tho people , and that the magistrates who ordered them to do so wtre the very pink of humanity . Air . G . Wood felt it a du'y ( connected as he had been wiih tho proceedings of the magistracy iu the Manchester district" ) ,, to bear his testimony upon this occasion—( hear . ) The charges that hau been made were substantially , that the magistrates had refused bail in some instances , and demanded heavy bail ia others , ana tV > at tbe prisoners had

      experienced great discomfort in eonfiuvmont . As to the lcjigth of the remands , they were longer certainly than in ordinary cases , bui not from any desire to make thorn longer than was abao . ' utely n * cesaary . As to the refus-al of bail , undoubedly , before the examination * wero completed , aim before the masis triites knew tho nature of the chargi . s that might be made , they did noL think it uxpediLii ' . to admit tobu . il , As to thb wisdom of this course , he was perfectly ready to abide by tho decision of the Houso ; his own impression was in its favour . Th < -n as to the excessive bail , —it was in some cases required to b ^ large ; he felt anxious hin ; yelf , undtr the circumstances , on whioh ho communicated with the magie'iacy ; but when it was conaicjertd that it had been by no nuana

      certain that bomo ot the prisoners had not rendert d ih ' .-mselvt -s liable for Charges of high treason , he thought the House would agree that it wss no more than wiso and prudent to exact such bail as , without being too excessive , should secure their appearance to answer to the lawt > of tht ; ir country . —( hoar , hear . ) With regard to the question of diaconjfort , it was certainly to be regretted that persons who , in law , wero tu be deemed innocent until found guilty , should bo 6 ubj « ct to any uim < cessary hardship while under deU-utiou ; but some degree of hardship had been absolutely unavoidable ; for the gaols had betm so crowded that ( tho weather being hoi ) some danger was apprehended of disease , and the prison was whitewashed . Every effort , however , had been made to mider the iuuouvenience as small as possible under this enormous ii . fliix of prisoners . With rispt-ct to the motion itself ( continued th © Hon . Member , alter a short pausb ) I have , personally , \ ui

      objection to it . ( A triumphant cheer from Mr . Duucombt : —hearty laugluer from Mr . Wakluy , aud ironical cries of ** hear , hear , " from the House generally , ) because I have no objection to inquiry , either into the conduct of tho magistrates or my own —( laughter and ironical choeie . ) I must guani mjs If against being supposed to a ^ niit , chore has beeiiuiaduoutany ground for icqui 1 y—( loud laughter ) or that there has been shown auy ju » t ground ot complaint on the part of the petitsoniDg prisoners—(' oui laughter aud "hear hoar , ' ) all of whom , 1 believe , har « been found guilty of" participating in the unlawful proceedings— ( hear , hear . ) More par-( icujary as to the conduct of Mr . Foster and Mr . Maude , I feel bound to declare that they are held 111 the highest esteem by meu of all parties ; and 1 believe that the imputations involved in this motion will not mcfct with tho smalle .-t support— (^ rcat laugnter and ironical cheeru . )

      Colonel Holle ion ( who spoke in a most inaudible tone ) said the berious charges of the Hon . Mover Wt , r « not worthy ot the align test credit ; and that it was well known the conduct of the magistracy had not deservod the imputations directed against them ; bu ; , on the contrary , had been justified in tueir proceedings by tho dangerous incendiary language which liad beun employed at tho public meetings . ( Hear , hear ) Tho outbreak was not confined to persons belonging either to tho town of Nottingham or the coumy of Nottingham , but amongst tho mob were persons froro Derbyshire and other places , which plainiy showed that it was of a most serious nature , andj . that the magistrates were perfetly justified in taking strong measures for its suppression in the first instance .

      Captain Berkeley said , it was an injustice to tho gentlemen whose names were brought forward that Ibis fuqairy should not be granted ; and for that reason , he thould support tbe motion of his Hon . Frii nd . Mr . BnoTHKBTon defended the conduct of tho Magibtra'es and Police of Manchester . Lord Iisokstrie ppun a long yarn chiefly from thp affidavits of themselves in defence of the Staffordshire " Shallows . " Me admitted that they had committed an error , but he thought they deserved the gratitude of the country .

      Mr . R . Scott supported the motion . The conduct of the magistrates in many of the cases alluded to had been , in hia opinion , most an warrantable . He knew it to be a fact , that on the morning appointed for the trial of O'Neill , the Chartist preacher , because there happened to be a crowd iu the street , without the slightest appearance of tumult , the Magistrates w > nt to the wiudows of the Court-houso , where thr > y had assembled for judicial business , and read the Riot Act . In another instance , a person of the name of Cooko had been arrested for exhibiting a placard printed by O Null , in which there was noihiiig seditious or improper , aiid actually brought to trial ou an indictment for stopping the Qmon's highway , by puttittx a bill in his window , which the people had betu induced to read . Surely in these

      cases , the liberty of the Ribject had bten grosoiy violated . Tao Attorney-General had given no answer to the charges brought forward by the Hon . Mt . mber for Ftnbbury . The Him and Learned Gen Ijeman said these Were not cases for enquiry by th © HoUbO , but for indictments or ac . ions at law ; but although the parties aggrieved might procood in each cuse , and obtain damages in a c u-t of law , it was only by an inquiry before that Houso that all the cases coulu be fairly investigated , and the general conduct of tho magistrates fairly ascertained . In matters of discretion , ho was willing to allow the magistrate !* every latitude , but when they proceeded to breaches of the law , and gross invasions of the libf-rty of ihu subject , instead of preserving the public peace , it wa ? the duty of that House strictly and impartially to inquire into their conduce .

      Sir J . Graham wished , before the debate closed , to address a very few words to the House . The Hou . Glntlcman who had just sat down would , ho believed , be alone in tho opinion that his Hon . and Learned Friend the Attorney Genual had made an unsatisfactory reply to the spetcii of the Hon . Member for Fiasbary . He would say with confidence , that a more" full , complete , ( spirited , and satisfactory answer had never been given to any charge than by his Hon . and Luarned Friend tonight—( hear , hear , hear ) . Hia Hon . and Gallant Friend ,, the Member for Glocester , had truly slated that all tho facts of this case had been completely disposed of . The allegations of the Hon . Member for Fmsbury had been dealt with seriatim by gentlemen 011 both sides of the House competent to give evidence on each of the charges . The Man Chester case had been disposed of by his Hon . and

      Learned Friend the Attorney'General ; the Dudley case had also been satisfactorily disposed of , notwithstanding what had since fallen from tha Hon . Gentleman who had just sat down , by his Hon . Friend the Member for Droitwitch ; ( here did not remain unanswered a single statement which had been made by the Hon . Member for Finsbury . The judgment of the Court of Queen ' s Bench bad oeeu relied on . It was vastly well for the Honourable Member for Walsall to say that charges of this kind should bo investigated by the House of Commons , but that case had already beon carefully investigated , and sifted to the very bottom , by the highest tribunal of the country . It had been heard bettre a single judge , Mr . Justice Patteson . He long hesitated whether he should ^ rant a criminal ir . farmation . The first inclination of his mind was not to grant it , but for the puiposo of having a

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      most important question sifted , thoroughly , he consented to grant a rule . It came on upon motion before the Court of Queen's Bench . The case was fully argued , jand the judgment ' of tho Court was pronounced in ] the terms read by his Hon . Friend the Member of DrOitwioh , He would not weary the House by quoting the precise expressions . It was true that costs had been awarded , butou the express ground , as stated by the Chief Justioe , that the magistrates w ; ere wrong in their law . The rule being that no criminal information should be granted by the Court where the animus of the magistrates was held to be pure , the Chief Justice stated that tho magistrates had to act in circumstances of great public dangeri ; it being the opinion of the Court

      that they had acted in the midst of that danger firmly , honeatly , with the purest ? nd best , intentions , they positively refused to grant a criminal information ; at the same time it being admitted that the magistrates were wrong in law , costs , as he had taid , were awarded ^ Where , then , was the necessity for investigating this matter before a select commutes ? The law and \ the detaila had already been fully cleared up by the highest tribunal ia the country . But , said the li < ju . Member for Fins-bmy , the magistrates were dismissed with censure by the Court oi Queen ' s bench . He positively denied that . So-far from impuuug censure , the coneluduigsentence of the judgment gavelpmise to the magistrates . The Chief Justice said , " Thrf opinion of these magistrates was

      hastily adopted , iu a crisis of real danger , and inosi probably from deference to a general resolution . This induces iis , in conformity with the rule by which this coui ^ t has regulated i ; s practice , to decline inttjri ' tring by ! a criminal information , and wo discharge the rule ; but as the couduc , of the magistrates was such as to justify tho application , they must pay the co . He . " He repeated his assert ion that with respect to the animus which dictated 'ho proceedings oi these magistrates , the Court of Qu ^ en ' o B « nch , so far from censuring them , discharged them without any imputation upon thm- conduct . In point of law jthcy were undoubtedly wrong , and they were therefore ordered to pay the costs . With respect then to jthe Dudley case , there was no reason

      lor instituting an investigation beforo a committee of th . it House . There might have been some doubt whether , considering the circumstances , that tlia applicaais entertained strong political opinions ai * d were connected : with a violent political movement , the refus-al to take bail was or was not justifiable by law . His apprehension of the law always led him to beltove that the decision of the Dudley magistrates was improper ; and any doubt which . had existed ou the subject had been cleared up by' the judgment in the case . It was needless to refer to the three ca .-es | whioh had been tried at Lancaster . The petitioners were , first , the printer of a placard which the Attorney-General had pronounced to be ; a document which , if not

      treasonable iu is charaet r , might bo considered as bordering on the very ivurge of treason , when coupled with thfc overt aovs which had beeu committed , and this person pleaded ; guilty . The second petition was from tho Chairman of the Executive Council from which this placard emanated , and who was convicted ; aud the third petitioner , who w ^ s acquitted , was an individual in ] whose chapel wero held Jthe nieetinga of this Exeouiive Council , by whom the oangeroua and seditious , i ; not treasonable , placards issued . So much , then , for the Lancaster arid DudJ' -y cases . He now caue fo the case affecting the ilon . Member for the county of Nottingham , ( f ' ol . Rolleston )' , wko had given a most clear attd distinct explanation to the Hou ^ e ; and they muf-t

      rtmember that \ this statement did not r < si on any douhtf ' ul authority , but that the Hon . Gentleman was himself a witness of all the transactions reftrrvd to m the petition . Ths House muht bear in mind that though , io this instance , one Jury tried all the cases—though ail the prisoners were included m the sacio ii'diotMieut , and were arraigned together , and pleaded to "hat * indictment conjointly—iu order to afford them a more fair trial , and to give them an opportunity of separate justification , they w . re classified and tried separately . One Jo > -y , however ; had them in charge } they pleaded to this Jury ; and his Hon . Friend had no choice , for the only course he could pursue was to try them by one Jury . Then an imputation had been thrown upon hi 3 Hon .

      Friend , that he was the committing magistrate , and had also presided at the trial ; but a more monstrous proposition could no ' be advanced than that it was not competent to a magistrate to comrau a person for trial , and then to preside at the trial of such person at the quarter sessions . The committal was made upon an ex parte statement , and the magistrate was callod » pon to consider whether the » e was ground for placing theaccnted upon trial ; but , when the prisoner was tried by a jury , the magistrate hoard not onlv ' the accusation but the defence . It was , indeed , a case of every day occurrence that a magistrate , having committed on an ex parti statement , was , at ; the sessions , favourable to the

      acquittal of the prisoner . He ( Sir J . Graham ) had lonu had the pleasure of an intimate acquaintance with the Hon . Member for Fin = bury ( Mr . T . Duncombo ) , who had brought forward this mot on . During his ( Sir J . Graham ' s ) absence from the House last night , at the close oi' the discus » ion iu Committ' -e of Supply , the Hon . and Gallant Member fur Maryiobone ( t 5 ir C . Napier ) -nadean observation which struck him as beiDg extreme '} ' just . Th Hon . Gdiitleman Said that monomania was the ordt-r of the day ( laughter ) , and he illustrated ihe remark by an allusion to the Hon . and gallant ifiu-er iho Member fvoui Brighton , observing that whenever the Poor Laws were mentioned , that Hon .

      Gentleman-Captain Pechell ( interrupting ) . —The Hon . Member for Maryk-botie referred to an Hon . Gentleman behind you . ( Laughter . ) Sir J . Graham . *—Whene'er the Poor Laws were mentioned , the Hon . and Gallant Member for Brighton set-mod always to have in his mind's eye that . terrestrial paradise—that Gilbert Uuiim in West Sut-sex—1 % laugft)—which tho Hon . Gentleman patat .-u iu such e ' pwing colours , and to which he had extended his especial protection . ( Laughter . ) When an Assistant Toor Law Commissioner was mentioned , the mind of the Hon . Member for Knarcsborough ( Mr . Ferrand ) was haunted ^ by images ot Mr . Mott , and by recollections of the K -ig ' iley Uuion

      —( a laugh)—aud he indulged the House with a detail of the oppression to whioh the poor in tho north ' of England were exposed . He had always considered that the Hon . Member for Fmsbury ( Mr . T . Duncombe ) was a gentleman of strong understanding , that his mind was unclouded by acy vulgar prejudices —( loud laughler}—but it appeared to him that the Hon . Member was not quite free from monomania—( a laugh . ) Ttiat Hon . Gentleman seemed to be haunted with the idea that all the Judges were necessarily wrong jn their decisions , —that all Magistrates were monsters of tyranny and oppression , — that juries could not properly perform their duties , and that Chartists were the brightest examples of innocence , and purity , aud kindness . ( Laughter . ) This

      was the extraordinary delusion under which the Hon . Member seemed to be labouring . At that eventful period , at the commencement of last Autumn , to which such frequent referencehau beenmadeto-night , he ( Sir James ) had , amidst much peril and anxiety , an opportunity of forming a judgment as to the manner in whioh jihe magistrates of this country tiisei arg . d their dut es ; and he would be betraying hia trust if be neglected to state to the House that , if happily this kingdom then escaped the imminent aurj serious danger of an insurrection of a most formidable character , widely spread , anl threatening not only property but life—if this country escaped such danger without much loss of life , without the inflict on of serious injury upon pro-Dtriy , its escape was mainly attributable to the

      support which heri Majesty ' s Govcrnmetu received irom ihe magistracy— - ( hear , and eherrs ) It niig " ht be invidious to allude to any particular instants , but two had already been referred to by the Hoa , Member for FinsbuVy—those of the Lords-Lieutenant of the Counties ofi Stafford and Worcester . Tho Lord-Lieutenant of Staffordshire was not here at tho commencement of the disturbances ; but tho Lord-Lieutenact of Worcestershire * Hvas in town at that period , and at his ( Sir J . Graham ' s ) request , at tho short not'ee of two hours , that gentleman went down to his county to discbarge his tfiicial duties for tho preservation of the public peace . It mi ^ ht , as he had before observed , be deemed invidious thus to allude to particular cases , but , as the Hon . Member for Finsbiiry had mcntioued tho Lords-Lieutenant for S : aff . > rddhireaud

      Worcestershire—Mr . T . DuNCOMBSsaid he had referred only ta the Lord-Lieutenant for Worcestershire . Sir J . Gkahah proceeded , — Very well ; then he would say , that frC > m the commetiGenieat of these disturbances he hail received no more active aud efficient support from any individual far the maintenance of the publjc peace than had bteu rtncitnd by the Lord Lieutf-uant of the county of Woroet . ter . Various subjects had been mentioned during this discussion to which it would be unnecessary fur him to advert , but he fell it his duty to refer to one point which had been touched upon by tho Hun . Member tor Fjnsbuijy . That Hon . Gentleman had asserted—and as a military man he must have mad * .-the statement with great pain and hesitation— Uia « . liquor was given to ihe soldiers at Halifax , that they were intoxicated before they were called upon to act , and that a breach of military discipline eusued .

      Now , until the Hon . Member made this assertion , he ( Sir J . Graham ) { had never heard such a charge mentioned , either in that House or out of it ; and , with all respect for ] the Hon . Gentleman , he must deolare that he could not place credit in the statement . The officer ! in command of the district in which . Halifax was situated waa a gentleman of the highest merit and j of extensive experience , —an officer who maintained among the troopa the Strictest discipline---General Brotherton ; at the head of the army pf this country was an officer pre-eminently distinguished by his military talents , but in no respect more distinguished than by his invariable , never-flinching determination to maintain the mo 9 t severe discipline ; and he ( Sir J . Graham ) was perfectly satisfied that , if any such accusation as that which had bten advanced by the Hon . Member for Finsbury could have been substantiated , it would not have remaned a secret until -. his

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      time ; but the military authorities would have instituted a most strict investigation on the subject . The Hon . Member , with respect * to his allusion , to tbe case of Pcestoa , had received an answer upon matters of fact so conclusive , that it tended to throw some shadow of doubt upon his allegation as to the occurrences at Halifax . The Hon . Gentlcmaa had also expressed doubts as to whether the troops were justified in acting with decision at Blackburn . It was a disgrace to this country to admit—but the fact showed the lamentable and dangerous extent to which the insurrection had spread—that , for two or three days during the month of August , the town of Blackburn might be considered as in a state of siege . The troops durst not venture in small bodies beyond

      the precints of the town ; mobs of 12 , 000 or 13 , 000 persons entered the p lace from the neighbouring districts ; the authorities interposed , and several prisoners were apprehended , and when they were about to be removed an attempt was made to rescue them . —( Mr . Duncombe here expressed dissent . ) He ( Sir j . Gra . nam ) said , an attempt was decidedly made a . t a rescue . Tbe Hon . Gentleman said that the troops were so pressed , that when they fired they were within two yards of the crowd , and he questioned the humanity of the proceeding , oc the ground that they did not use the bayonet instead of the mu .-ket . Could anybody then doubt what was ^ tae situation of the troops at this crisis , when it was state ! that this band only consisted of thirty men ? That

      , being the case it must be evident that they were in imminent danger , pressed as they were on every pide by au immense multitude ; nevertheless , until the or . ier was given not a shot was fired , and when , they did fire , in order to prevent as much as possible any unnessary loss of life , they fired by single file , umi ! at length , having kept ; perfece order , thry were enaMfcd to retreat , although they were so mucn , pressed by number 3 , ftvincing , he was sorry tosay , coutrary to the usual character of English mobs , aniost sanguinary disposition , and armed with dangerous weapons . One of the Hon . Members for Finsbury ( Mr . Wakley ) was a coroner . He would not , therefore , set up a committee of the House of Commons aa more fit , to try a question of this nature than a

      coroner ' s jury . But , in fact , there had been an inquest which had tried the question , and which , after a long investigation , returned a verdict of " Justifiable homicide . " ( Hear , hear . ) Then with respect to the conduct of the mayor—in his ( Sir J . Graham ' s ) opinion , that magistrate ' s conduct was marked with the utmost intrepidity ; ho wa 3 present during the whole proceeding ; he took the command of the troops ; he did not order the firing until the danger was pressing ; he stopped the firing the moment the dunger was overcome ; and he ( Sir J . Graham ) was bound to say that , in his opinion , by the good conduct of thai , magistrate a very great service had been performed . The military head of the troops was satisfied with his conduct : the town was

      satisfied ; and if he ( Sir J . Graham ) mistook not , he had been presented with the thanks of his fellow townsmen for his conduct on that occasion . Ha had now gone through tha principal charges brought forward by the Hon . Gentleman , and he must repeat the question which had been so forcibly put by his Hon . and Learned friend the Attorney General , and ho asked the House to consider how dangerous motions of this kind wero when brought forward under the semblance of maintaining the administration of justice , and when in reality they interfered with the due administration of justice , and never more bo than on this occasion . A statement had been made by his Hon . and Learned Friend—it had been wrung from him—of what was the conduct of ene

      individual at Manchester , when the delegates broke up , after having completed the arrangements which th ^ y had entered into by a conspiracy ; his Hon . and Learned Friend had disclosed the speech which was made by an individual who was then on his trial at Stafford for hi 3 conduct on that occasion . But the p 'r&ons in respect of whom this motjon was made w-jre at that moment awaiting the judgment of the Court of Queen ' s Bench , and the judges of that court would shortly have to consider what their punishment should be . It was most painful to his Hoo . and Learned Friend , under such circumstances , to have to make statements which might have a tendency to aggravate the punishment of those individuals . The motion , however , led to this , and so

      had a tendency £ 0 interfere with ^ ine administration of justictj . On these grounds he thought it , with the Hon . Member flJirKendal ( Mr . G . W . Wood ) , "illtimed ; " he thought it "not sustained ; " he thought it " cast a stigma on the magistrates of the country . " In all this he fully concurred with the Hon . Member for Ki-ndul ; but he muBt say , that having received gr < at aid from the Hon . Gentleman in his magisterial capacity , in the county of Lancaster , and having had occasion to know that , as the Lord Chief Justice said , the magistracy did in the main give their cordial support to the maintenance of law and the security of property still he must say that , h&viug this feeling with respect to the conduct of tho Hon . Member as a magistrate , and having received every assistance from him in his magisterial capacity , if anything

      cou . d shake his confidence in the firmntss and judgement of tho Hon . Member , he ( Sir J . Graham ) did noi say . 'iu his capacity as a magistrate , but as a Member of the House , it would be to fiud him , after having declared that the motion was ill-timed and not sustained , and that it cast a stigma ou the magistracy , from some sensitive apprehension that his conduct should bo misunderstood , voting for it nevertheless —( " hear , hear , " and laughter ) Thai he must say did strike him with astonishment , thought it could not shako his respect for the Hon . Member ' s character ; but he did hope that other Hon . M&mbers , thinking with the Hoa . Member for K * udal , would decisively mark their sense of this motion by putting the Hon . Member for Finsbury in a small minority . Mr . G . Wood said , that it was solely on the grouud that his own conduct was impeached by this motion : hat he voted for it .

      Mr . Mcntz did not appprove of the conduct of these people ; he could not excuse their conduct ; but at the same time , if it were not for the judgment of tin Queen ' s Bench he could not excuse the conduct of the Dudley magistrates , when they acknowledged that bail oujsjhi to De taken and yet refused to take it . from regard to the politics of tho parties . If the 0 , 'Ken ' d Bench had not shown these gentlemen that the magistrates could not do so with impunity , ho should have voted for the motion ; as it was , ha should oppose it . Mr . V . Stuabt had to state , on the part of Sir Charles Shaw , that he was most anxious to have an inquiry , and from his ( Mr . V . Stuart's ) acquain ? tauct ; with that gentleman he must say he delieved i if an inquiry were granted , he would coma out of it with honour to himself .

      Mr . AiNtwoKiH , from his acquaintance with tha circumsiance , could say , of the magistrates of Preston , that their conduct was most exemplary in every trying and difficult circumstances . Captain Vivian said that the Hon . Member for Finsbury ( vlr . T . Duncombe ) had stated that tha troops at Halifax had been given drink , to make them do their duty . Now , here was no duty so painful to a soldier as to have to suppress disturbances in his native country , and he thought ( ha 4 the House agreed with him that no blame could be cast on the troops for their conduct on that occasion The Hou . Member oughc to be more guarded in his language , because few things wtio likely to be more painful to a soldier's fetiiings than the imputation the Hoa . Memotr had made .

      Mr . T . iDvxcuiiBE said , ho only stated that the troops had acted under th'J orders of the magistrates , and not that tho troops were responsible for what occurred , aud that a gentleman gave money , which money was spent in drink , which the soldiers fi ' id previous to their being called out aud previous to their acting . Ho had also stated , that in Blackburn ale and cheese had been supplied by the inhabitants to the soldiera beyond what tia ^ y were entitled to . Whether they had a right to do so 0 * not , he was not disputing . But he must suy that it had a very bad appearance , and was complained of * that the military previous to being called um should in some places receive money , which t ) Ky spent in intoxieatiug liquors , and in other places rations beyoud what they were entitled to . The Hon . Member for Birminyhom seemed to think that his ( Mr . Duncombe ' s ) motion was directed against Messrs . Badger

      and Camvn ^ ht , but that was a mibtaue . He did not waat to inquire into their case . It had been disposed of by the Queen ' s Bench . The rule bad bd . n ditmissed , and they ordered to pay the costs . Ho rep ^ a ' . cd , therefore , _ that their conduct had been ceusuivd fay the Ciiiet du .-uicaof that Court , andie was surprised when the Right Hon . Baronet read one pci-iiun of that Judge ' s opinion that he had not ais > T-. atl tfiat portion to which he ( Mr . Dut . coiaibe had Kici-r- d . ( Sir J . Graham— " You read it youri scif ' . " ) Tnere were then but few Members in &be House , . iEd he would read it sgain . The Hon . Gen ^ iictiia /; / iuwi : g done so , proceeded to observe , that howevor Borne Honourable Members might thins thi ^ e magistrates enti led to tho confidence of the i-luuse , his belief , founded on the opinions of Coke , Hale , Blackburne , and Denman , was , that th ^ y wtre guilty of and indictable for an offence against tke liberty of the subject . —f he House might besto * C Concluded in our first page .

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      O'CONNOR , Esq . of Hammersmith , County Middlesex , by JOSHUA HOBSON , at his Printing Offices , Nos . 12 and 13 , Market-street , Briggatei asd Published by th # said Josuva Hobsoh * ( for tbe said Fkaegcs O'Connok . ) at bis Dwalliug-hous * , No . 6 , Market-street , Briggate ^ ; »» internal C » mmunication axxBting hstwotn the sal * No . 5 , Market-stre « t , and tne said Nos . 13 and 13 , Market-stieetj Brlggate * thua _ constituting the whole of the said Printing and ^ Publisfling Office one Promises . All Commuaic&tloim mtuA b » addressad , Post-paid , to Mr . HOBSOK ., Nerthem Star Office , Leeds . ( Saturday , April 8 , 1813 . )

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      P THE NORTHERN STAR .

      Leeds ;—Printed For Tha Proprietor Pearg? S

      Leeds ;—Printed for tha Proprietor PEARG ? S

  • Citation
    • Northern Star (1837-1852), April 8, 1843, page 8, in the Nineteenth-Century Serials Edition (2008; 2018) ncse-os.kdl.kcl.ac.uk/periodicals/ns/issues/vm2-ncseproduct797/page/8/