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Northern Star (1837-1852), 6th March 1847, Edition 1 of 3, Page 8, ? $oti0c of Commons

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      THURSDAY Feb . 25 . THB TRUCK SYSTEM . _ Mr . Thoma . Du . vcohbe presented a petition from the National Association for the protection of native industry , signed by forty thousand , complaining of the truck system , and praying that imprisonment might be substituted as a punishment for those who resort to it , instead of a money fine , as under the Aet of last Session ; also a petitien from the willow manufacturers of the metropolis , complaining of the distressed condition of those engaged in that trad ? .

      TENANT BIGHTS ( IRELAND ) BILL . —Mr . Sha * - jcas Cbawfobd rose to moTe for leave to bring in a bill to secure the rights of occupying tenants in Ireland , and thereby to promote the improvement of the soil , and the employment of the labouring classes . Nothing could be more unsatisfactory or injurious than the mode of letting land in the greater part of Ireland . It had been said that small holdings had been the ruin of Ireland , but the insecurity on whish the small holdings in Ireland were held , had been the ruin of that country . He had made a comparison between the counties of Down and Limerick ' , and he found in the one , where tenant right existed , there ¦ was comfort , a » d in the other , where it did not , there was nothing but misery . Thehon . member then readfrom agent * in Ireland facts confirmatory of his * tatement ,

      and proceeded to say that his object was to secure by law that which at present existed only by sufferance . To secure that simply was the object of the bill he wished to introduce . New , the farms in Ireland might be classed as follows : —306 , 915 of 5 acref , 251 , 158 of 15 acres aad 48 , 312 of 40 acre * . If the occupiers of the second class could be induced to spend to the value of £ 10 in labour on the land , it would realise £ 2 , 514 , 000 ; and if theother classes would spend in the same proportion , £ fi , 0 oo , 000 SttJVE ? * * * ^ "P ^^ -ouldgiTeemploy-T ^ S £ ' * nppWt t 0 m - m famlli " - K «» ey SSfSl ? * ^ . ? 16 "* and ****« " farmer beliew fcm expend Give him a tenant-ri ght to his land , and he would , of course , wish to improve that land . ( Hear ) Leare wag giren to bring iatbeWll .

      POOR KAIES ( IRELAND ) BILL .-Mr . Shabka .. Cbawfobd moved the second reading of the bill . He proposed that the poor-rates should . not be paid by te . VZX f Wt bat ^ ttey 8 h 00 ld * p " * p » id b /* landlords , and where the landlord did not collect his rents , a receiver should be appointed by the Court of Chancery . * The bill was read a second time , and was ordered to be committed this day fortnight . MARKETS AND FAIRS CLAUSES BILL .-This bill went through commutes . The other orders of the day were then disposedof , and tne house adjourned . FRIDAY , P « . Sfi . s , r CHA . M , k * meb made hi * annual statement o ! the condiuon of the . hipping in her Majesty ' s navy . He made various inggestions of improvements with respect ^ 7 ? f r ? U ? n Of Eeamen ' the institution of the

      NAVAL ESTIMATES .- * , wli announced that the gross amount required for the navy would exceed that proposed last year b y £ 62 , 000 , and the actual money rote by £ 77 , 000 , the whole sum necessary for the service of England being £ 5 86 fiO 0 O He then explained that the Ministry liftJS the Admiralty in carrying out naval schools for the education of apprentices , shipwrights , and inspectors , and that every exertion should be made for th « naval defence of the country . A desultory discussion followed on various points con nected with the estimates . Tarious estimates were agreed to , and the house resumed . To sit again on Monday . MONDAY , Mabch 1 . WAGES IN SLIGO . —In answer to a question from Mr . W . s . O'Brien ,

      Mr , Laboocheee had made inquiries and bad ascertained that the . wages given to the labourers InSligo mounted to only eightpence a day , and the reasons which had induced the Board of Works to fix them at as * mi ? WMe thMe : —rnt' » e first place it was desired abour 1 ~ " PowiMe to encourage task work , and the refusert »^ tUng ^ gbtpence a da * were onl , | thoielwbo the ordinar * Thea U ¦ hould be remembered that wereonlviwl **' 1 / 01 ' ¦«* utairai labour in Ireland iL « nS ^ : c r dUwas ? tr < iaeiyiiDportant hould b . diverted ^ ' £ . * " absolutely necessary « - — siari SKjift

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      ————^—^——«^—^ ^ m ^ mm ——letter to fix the wages at eightpence , providing for the caiei where it was insufficient for the support of a f imily , by allowing more than one member of such f . mily to be rated on the works . With reference to the ttier point , namely , the proportion which the expenses if tha sr . ff bore to the expenditure for labour , he had nadc inquiries , and ) he could assure the hon . member ¦ iat any apprehensions on that subject were unfounded . The number of labourers employed on the public works in Sligo fluctuated between 19 and 22 , 000 . For these there was one pay clerk for 1 , 250 labourers , one overseer for every 40 , an . l one check clerk for every 250 , the expenses of the whole staff being £ 2 , 110 per month . This was of course , exclusive of the inspectors' salaries , who were paid out of the Consolidated Fund .

      CULTIVATION OP THE SOIL ( IRELAND ) .-Lord r . RosnEtt , in answer to Sir D . Xorreys , said that he was n eonstaut communication with the lord-Ueutenant of Ireland on this most important subject , and he was sorry tj say that he was not at all satisfied that there was in Ireland sufficient land being prepared for tillage to supply ihe want of the potato , supposiug none of the latter to be sown . With respect to a proclamation recommending tillage , he did not think it at all desirable that govern , ment should interfere in such a question , ( near , hear . ) lie was quite sure that the lord-Ueutenant had alread y called the atteution of the landed proprietors to the subject , and besides , he really thought that the proprietors and farmers themselves should be fully aware of the danger likely to arise from a failure in the quantity of food next season .

      WAYS AND MEANS—THE EIGHT MILLION LOAy . —The Chanceixob of the Exchequer , after thanking the house for the kind indulgence which he had received at its hands ou a former occasion , ¦ ibserved that he had then declared that , to meet the extraordinary demands made upon him for the relief of Ireland in her present state of distress , he had determined to contract aloau of £ 3 , 000 , 000 . It was a matter of satisfaction to him , that the houee generally had acceded at once to the propriety of the loan which he then proposed ; and be now had to inform it he bad that morning entered into engagements for a loan of £ 8 , 000 , 000 , and that lie wag about to propose resolution for tbe confirmation of those engagements . The government had on former occasions entered into loans without

      the knowledge of the house ; but that practice had not been uniform . On the last occasion on which an Act of Parliament was passed for a loan it was passed for a lean which had been made some months previously . He had however followed a course which he deemed to be at once most respectful to the house and most advantageous to the public . The only question which he had afterwards to consider , was on what terms he could most easily obtain tbe money ; and on consulting with the highest authorites on the subject , it was deemed ' bat the easiest tctmi would be by giving 3 per Cent . Consolidated Stock , and by announcing that so much money must be paid for every £ 100 of that stock . Two offers—which

      in point of fact were identical and made with previous arrangement—had been tendered to him that morning , namely , to give £ 8910 s . for every £ 100 stock ; and those terms he bad felt himself justified iu accepting . The interest which be had engaged to pay for this loan , was £ 268 , 156 8 s . per annum , which would be raised by the charge of the Bank for its management to £ 270 , 600 ; or in other words would be £ 3 7 s . 6 d . percent , or 2 s . 6 d . less than the 3 J per cent , which he was supposed to have mentioned a few nights ago . He had allowed no discount , and was only to give stock for the instalments as the ; TOte paid up , except in the case of tne first instalment .

      In reply to a question from Mr . Hume , the right hon . gentleman further stated that the interest , if tbe whole loan were paid up , would commence from the 5 th of January last , but would not be paid till the 5 th of July next . If any one paid up his whole share of the loan before the 2 nd of July , he would be entitled to half a year ' s interest in July , and again in next January ; but if he did not pay up before that day , he would not receive half a year ' s interesttill January next . Mr . HcstE regretted that the government bad borrowed this loan in stock of a small denomination , as the public would lose largely by it ; 8 , 000 , 000 of stock at

      £ 89 10 s . was a very bad bargain for the public . He had not the slightset doubt that this stock would be at a premium of three or four per eent . to-morrow . Go . vernment would hare been enabled to make a much better bargain had it borrowed the money by publicadvertisement , and had accepted the offers of thoBe who sent in the lowest tenders at the smallest rate of interest . He had just been informed that this new stock was already at a premium of l \ per cent . Now that gave at once to the contractors a clear profit of £ 150 , 000 . Tbe bargain of the Chancellor of the Exchequer had lost the country half a million of money .

      Mr . Williams also expressed his sorrow that the Chancellor of the Exchequer had followed in the beaten track of all his predeetssors in office except Mr . Goulburn . By the course which they had adopted £ 175 , 000 , 100 had been needlessly added to tbe national debt . From the srdinary price of the funds at present , it was quite clear that the Chancellor of the Exchequer had thrown away at least 2 per cent , by his bargain . He ought to have got £ 1 sterling for his £ 1 stock . It appeared that £ 10 , 000 , 000 were wanted for Ireland , and that we had £ 9 , 000 , 000 of balances in the Exchequer . Now , if the

      Chancellor had issued 4 , 000 , 000 of Exchequer Bills at the increased rate of 2 d . a-day , they would Still havo retained a considerable premium , ne would then have had but a very moderate sum indeed to borrow , supposing always that his estimate of the revenue for the coming year was correct . He protested against any addition to the national debt in time of peace . He thought that if the Chancellor of the Exchequer pursued the ceurse which he ( Mr . Williams ) recommended , he would be able to fund his Exchequer Bills at a convenient time , and would so be able to save a considerable sum to the public .

      The resolutions were then agreed to . On the Chais . han moving that he should report them to the house . Sir R . Isciis expressed a wish that this sum of £ 8 , 000 , 000 had been raised by taxation instead of by loan ; for then it would bate been a sacrifice for one year only , and would not have east a burden upon future generations . Mr . Htske again repeated his objections , which he was afraid that he had not made intelligible to the Chancellor of the Exchequer , Mr . Williams wished to know who the two parties were who bad made the biddings for this loan ! The Chancellor of tbe Exchequer replied , that the parties were the Messrs . Rothschild and the Messrs . Baring . Mr . Heue doggedly insisted thaturi r bis system , supposing that no bidding had b « en for less than £ 5 , 000 , 001 , there would have been 16 competitors , and not two only , for this loan .

      Tbe Chaihhan wag then directed to report the resolutions to tbe bouse , and the report was ordered to bu received on Tuesday . POOR RELIEF ( IRELAND ) BILL . —Lord John Russell then moved that the house go into committee , pro forma , on the poor relief ( Ireland ) bill . In doing so . he would briefly advert to the substantial amendments which he proposed to engraft upon tbe present Poorlaw Bill . These amendments would thus be in possession of the houee at an early period than otherwise , which he was desirous that th « y should be , as he proposed to go into committee on the till on Monday next , with a view to the discussion of its details . It had been suggested that the following case might arise under the provisions of the bill . Empowering the guardians to

      relieve the able-bodied poor out of the workhouse , when tbe workhouse was full , or when fever raged in it , so that it would be unsafe to introduce them , viz ., tbat the guardians might refuse to give relief to the number sufficient to fill the workhouse , and then refuse to give relief to the destitute able-bodied without became the workhouse was not full . Additional words were proposed to be added to the clause , giving the power alluded to , s » as to prevent the abuse suggested . Au amendment was also to be introduced into clause 2 , in reference to the enlargement of tbe workhouses in certain cases , As to clause 0 , he proposed so to alter the liability for charge of out-door relief in each union The change thus proposed was to place the charge of such relief , up to a certain amount , upon the electoral districts . If the charge should exceed 2 s . Cd . in the pound for a year , then , and in that case , the extra

      amount should be charged upon the union at large . He also proposed an alteration in regard to the number of m offlcio guardians ; as well as to introduce a clause , similar to one iu the temporary bill passed a few weeks go , giving power to the poor-law commissioners to remove the guardians and appoint paid guardians in their stead , iu default ^ of the former in performing their duties . These were the main alterations which he proposed to engraft upon tbe bill . It was proposed by some that relief should not be administered in Ireland to persons possessing above half an acre ot land . He thought that there should be some limit in this respect ; but n » was of opinion that , under present circumstances , it should be so defined that persons occupying merely cot . tagei , and small patches of ground attached to them , should not when destitute be disqualified from rectiriug relief , ne then moved that the house should go into committee pro forma upon the bill .

      Mr . Shaw observed , that , if they gave a right to relief , they should accompany that right with a law of settlement . Was the noble lord prepared to go that far ! In answer to a question by Sir R . Peel , Lord J . Kusseix said that the right to relief would not be exactly the same as it was in England . All relief was to be given in the shape of food . Relief was sometimes given here to families when a child or any other member of a family was sick . It was not intended to extend this system to Ireland . But a right to relief was to be given to the destitute poor iu the woikhouse , with a power vested in the guardians , when the workhouse was full , to relieve the ablebodied poor out of it . A desultory debate ensued , aud the bill went through committee pro forma . The report to be received next Monday .

      LANDED PROPERTY ( IRELAND BILL ) . —Lord J . Remix then moved the reading of the order of the day nthe Landed Property ( Ireland ) Bill , with a view of postponing the committee thereupon till Monday . A short discussion followed ; during which Sir J . GiADAM , after expressing his conviction that every consideration of economy , both for the present and tbe future , demanded tbat the government should , as far as possible , employ the Irish people in reproductive works , intimated that , in his opinion , there was no mea * sure calculated to effect 60 much for the present and permanent amelioration of Ireland as that for giving ftcilitieito tenant * for life in that country tonlleva

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      themselves from their incumbrancesby the sale of a portion of their estater . He hoped the measure would not be too exclusively left in the hands of lawyers , as he feared they were taught by precedent that if it were ao the relief thus sought would not be afforded in as com . plete and effective a manner as wai desired . In de . vising and carrying into effect a measure of this nature the plain rules of equity , and the rights of creditors and heirs should not be overlooked . Mr . Laboccbebe observed that but a short period would now elapse ere the other house of Parliament was occupied with a measure to facilitate the sale of encumbered estates . The order of the day was then read , and the committee was postponed UllMoniay . SUPPLY , —On the motion that the house go into com . mitteo of supply .

      Mr . Hume rose and called tbe attention of the government to tbe constant increase which was being effected in our naval | and military establishments , and consequently increased expenditure to which this gave rise . The estimates for the three departments of the navy , army , and ordnance had increased to a greater extent tnii year than for any year since 1822 . Sir De Laci Evans was in favour of economy ia the public expenditure , as far as wa& compatible with safety and with a due regard to the honour and interesti of the country , but no further . Lord G . Behtinck taunted the free traders upon the ftilure of their predictions , to the effect that free trade would bo bind nations in Christian unity together , as to enable them to raze their battlements , disband their armies , and dismantle their fleets , Mr . Williams protested against the increase in the expenditure adverted to , and concluded a lengthy speech with proposing a reduction in the army of 20 , 000 men .

      Mr . Biothe&ton protested against an innovation which had recently sprung upin that house . namely that of discussion with the Speaker in tbe chair questions which could not be dif cussed with any usefulresultexceptin committee . If that practice should continue , and if the evening should be wasted in future with such discussions as those to which they had listened that night , he would regularly move at 12 o ' clock tbat the chairman report progress , and ask leave to sit again , This annunciation was received with loud cheers . The debate ceased , and the house resolved itself into the proposed committee .

      Mr . Fox Ma ole stated th t the number of men to be voted for the ensuing year was 138 , 895 . The gross charge for these would be £ 5 , 155 , 646 . The charge for non-effective service would be £ 2 , 175 , 227 . Makiug a grand total charge of £ 7 , 331 . 075 . From this total was to be deducted the charge boine by the East India Company , for 30 , 497 , to the amount of £ » 72 , , and other sums , amounting in all to £ 1 , 056 , 100 , tearing tlie gross charge upon the country at £ 6275 , 074 , and the number of men in the effective service , the charge for whom fell upon the Exchequer , at 108 , 338 men . The rotes for the army estimates were then proceeded with and adopted in committee , after which the Chairman reported them to the house . TheConsolid » sUd Fund ( £ 8 , 006 , 000 ) Bill , was theuread a second time .

      Sir Geosge Gist then moved for and obtained leave to bring in a bill to amend the Act 9 th and 10 th Tic , c . 101 , authorizing the advance of public money for the improvement of land by drainage . Mr . Fox Ma ole then moved for and obtained leave to bring in a bill for limiting the period of enlistment in the army . He would explain tbe provisions of the bill when it was brought up far the second reading . The other orders were then disposed of , and the house adjourned at 12 o ' clock . TUESDAY , March 2 , Mr . SrooNEB gave notice , for the 16 th instant , to mote for leave to bring in a bill to suppress trading in prostitution . Mr . Plcshtrk , in contequ « nc « of the announcement made by the Premier on Monday evening , withdrew his notiee of motion relative to a day of general humiliation . In answer to Mr . Dillon Bsowme ,

      Mr . Labocchebe read a letter , dated the 9 th February , addressed to the Irish government , setting forth that an organised conspiracy existed in a part of the county of Mayo to resist the cultivation of tbe soil . JUSTICES OF LANCASTER . — Mr . T . Dtjhcombe said that it was his intention to call the attention of the house to the petitions which he presented from Warrington , complaining of tbe conduct ot' Messrs . Lyon and Stubbs , justices of the county of Lancaster , in the exercise of their summary jurisdiction , on the trial of four working men for leaving their employ , and to submit a motion thereon . He understood , however , tbat th * subjeut bad be <; n under the consideration of the government and he should like to know from the rigbt hon . baronet , the secretary of state for the home department , theresul , of that consideration . t

      Sir George Gbit said that tbe attention of the government bad been directed , notto the allegations as they appeared upon the face of the documents before the house , but with respect to the irregularity complained of in a petition recently presented to the house . The result of that consideration was , that the government bad come to the conclusion that the convictions were illegal , and Hint the petitioners were entitled to take advantage of the informality set forth in their petition . Mr . T . Ddncombe said that having beard from the government that the magistrates had acted in an illegal manner he was perfectly satisfied , and would therefore withdraw bis motion .

      SITES FOR CHURCHES IN SCOTLAND—Mr . Bodvebie moved for a " select committee to inquire whether , in what part of Scotland , and under what circumstances , large numbers ef her majesty ' s subjects have bceu deprived of the means of religious worship , by the refusal of certain proprietors to grant them sites for the erection of churches . " In making this motion , the honourable gentleman briefly reviewed the history of the Free Church , showing the cumber of people who adhered to its communion , the amount of money which it had raised for ecclesiastical and educational purposes within the last four years , the number of churches which it had built and was still building , and the number of schools which it had established , with the average amount contributed to each school—with a view to show that the secession which had taken place from the church was a permanent one , and that the disruption was not to pr « . ve an eranescent movement , as some bad

      anticipated that it would be . He then adverted to various instances of persecution suffered by the sect in question at the hands of the Duke of Buccleuch and others in the lowlands , and of Lord Macdonald , Sir Jas . Riddell , and others , in the Highland districts . In somt of these cases , the adherents of the Fice Church had been permitted to erect tents , for the purposes of public worship , which , in a climate like that of Scotland , amounted almost to a prohibition of public worship , so far as the parties in question were concerned . In numberless instances even the poor boon of a tent had not been accorded them , whilst in all tbe cases complained of , they bad been refused sites for the erection of schools and churctus . The grievance * complained of were to be deprecated , in the firnt place , because they amounted to religious persecution , and in the next , gave rise to feelings of exasperation in the breasts of large masses of depopulation of Scotland . Mr . Ewakt seconded the motion .

      SirG . Gbet said he had hoped that former discussions would have induced the Scotch proprietors to grant tbe necessary sites and regretted that they had not , H » saw no objection to the committee moved for ; and hs believed that the result of an inquiry would be to induce the great majority of the proprietors to grant to the « eceders whatever was reasonable . Sir R . Inolis opposed the motion . Sir James Gbahah had little to add or subtract from the opinions he had formerly expressed on this questien . He considered the " . hole subject had been exhausted , and tbat there was nothing to inquire into . The enly effect of granting the committee would be to establish the principle of a similar toleration to all religions . II « would oppose the motion .

      Lord G . Bentikck likewise opposed the metion , as he believed the effect of the committee would be to render the voluntary principle ft compulsory one . The noble lord vindicated the conduct of the Duke of Buccleush and Lord M&cdonald , who , he thought , had received go much abuse and vituperation as to justify them intheir refusals . Mr . Fox Macle and Colonel Mubk supported the motion . Mr . Stoabt Woutlet and Mr . Scott opposed it . L ord J . Russell said tbat the secession having taken place in Scotland , everything that th » bouie could do

      ouxht to be done to enabl * the seceding clergynun to administer spiritual advice and instruction to their flocks . It was evident tbat a comiderable grievance existed , and inquiry was , therefore , only fair . He had a great objection to any legislative interference , but should it be shown that thirty congregations were obliged to listen to divine service on a Sabbath in the open air , and subject to all the inclemency of the weather , he would be prepared to adopt some legislative remedy . He admitted the principle would be tbe same if applied to Roman Catholics or the Society of Friends .

      Mr . Scott opposed , and Colonel Mdbh supported th * motion . The House divided—Fortbemotion 99 Against it ... , 61 Majority for the motion —28 THE POOR REMOVAL BILL . —Mr . Banks moved for a " copy of the case submitted by the Poor Law Commissioners to the law officers of the Crown far their

      opinion , with reference to the construction of a clause in the Poor Removal Aet . " The clause in queition had been construed by tbe law officers of the crown in a manner the very reverse of the intention of tha framers of the bill . The most conflicting opinions were laoa * with respect to its proper interpretation ; and he thought their best course would be to pass a declaratory act which would explain the real meaning of the clause . The hon , gentleman then gave notice that he would after Eaater move for leave to bring in a bill to repeal or greatly modify the Poor Removal Act of last session .

      Mr . C . BiJLLEa obverved that , if the law officers of the Crown had deviated in Interpreting the act iu question from the obvious intention of its framers , ht was not prepared to say that the wider interprttation which had been put upon it by the law officers had bsen at all prejudicial to the people of this country . This was the opinion of tha committee which had been appointed to examine into the whole matter . Enough of the case alluded to , and of the opinion in reference to it , was alrtady before the h « ui « to satisfy any reasonable or « veu uareaiosable

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      man . The law of settlement was too grave a matUr to be thus taken up bit by bit . The whoU subject wa » under the consideration of the committee , which , when Uhadfally considered Km all lt » beating * , would present its report to tbe house . A lengthened discussion ensued , in which a great number of members took part , and ultlmattly Mr . Bankes withdrew his motion . INVESTMENTS IN RAILWAYS . —Lord Q . Bihtikck moved for a return , showing the sums of money actually expended by the railway companies previous to 1841 : — London' and Birmingham , Grand Juiction , Great Western , Brighton , South Western , South Eastern , and Midland ; likewise the aggregate sum expended by the above-mentioned railway comptnUi in each , jear

      previous to 1841 , with the view of elucidating the marvellous statement made by Mr . Goulburn in the late debate upon the budget . As a statement had gone forth to the public , on the authority of an tx-Cliancellor of the Exchequer , of a rrost extraordinary nature relative to the expenditure of railways , the effect of which would be to lead tbo public to tho conclusion tbat largo railway expenditure did not conduce to the prosperity of the country , it was absolutely neeessary to expoee the absurdity of that staUment . Tbs statement made by Mr , Goulburn was , that £ 37 , 729 , 400 had been expended in men railways during the years 1889 and 1840 , theae years of deficient revenue ; whereas the truth was , that , from 1836 to the end of 1840 , on tbs seven railways named only £ 20 , 437 , 115 had been actually expended . So that , if ft mil-statement of £ 17 , 291 , 000 , by a gentleman who

      once held the office of Chancellor of the Excheqner was not properly detignated " a marvellous statement , "be ( Lord G . Bentiuck ) knew not what the words meant . But that wai not tbe exteat of the Rigbt Hon . Gentleman ' s mis-statement , because , in 1839 and 1846 , only £ 9 , 718 , 997 had b « tn expended by the seven railway s referred to ; therefore tbe Bight Hon . Gentleman had made the marvellous mistake of £ 28 , 000 , 000 ! the statement containing this exaggeration had been made to tbe bouse with all the " pomp and circumstance" of an ex-Chancellor of the Exchequer , and he thought tbat tbe exposure which he had just made of it would put the house on iti guard for the future , against placing any reliance upon the itatements and statistics of Mr . Goulburn , although he bad been a Chancellor of the Exchequer ,

      Mr . GorLBTON observed , that if it was becoming in one who had be * n Chancellor of tbe Exchequer to make no statement which he could not substantiate , it was no less becoming in one who expected to become Chancellor of the Exchequer to refrain from grossly misrepresenting what any of his possible predecessors may have stated in the house . The noble lord had misunderstood him iu some instances , and misrepresented him in others . The statements which h « had made had reference to the expenditure , both effected and proposed on the railways in question for several years previous to 1841 , imtead of for two years , as the noble lord had

      stated . There were two ways of addressing th « houst —one , to presume that one is addressing educated men , who will supply all dtfiotenees ; and the other , to rtgard tbe houi * as a vulgar assembly , and to give every detail and leave nothing U be filled up . This former was the way in wh . chhe addressed the bouse , and he did not think it then necessary to make his figures perfectly plain . Tha returns were ordered , The other orders of the day were disposed of , and the home adjourned at twtlve o ' clock . WEDNESDAT Makch 3 . The Shakes took the chair at twelve o ' clock .

      Mr . Ddncombe presented a petition that railway companies should convey poor persons at a farthing a mile ; also a petition , signed by a number of the cloth-printers of Lancashire , which stated that they were in as bad a con . dition as were the people in the suffering districts of Ireland , and praying the government to giv « a grant of £ 30 , 000 in order that it might be invested in such a manner as to yield them employment . Lord John Rossell presented petitions from several places in Yorkshire , Lancashire , Cheshire , and Derby , hire , from various master manufacturers , signed on be . half of 538 firms ( hear , hear ) , stating , they thought it would be very desirable that the hours of labour should be shortened , and therefore praying the house to pass the Ten Hours Bill ; also petitions from persons employed ia manufactures in Bury and Hey wood , in favour of the Ten Hojrs Bill . A large number of petitions in favour of the Ten Hturs Bill were presented by other members .

      THE FACTORY BILL —The order of the day having been read forgoing into committee on the Factory Bill , Mr . EtCOTT rose to move , as an amendment , that the bill be committed tbat day six months . Those who considered that in this measure they were benefiting the la . bouring population in oar manufacturing districts , might be very benevolent persons , but they were at the same time most erroneous in their views . He himself regarded it as a measure which , in crippling energies and capital , would inevitably mest materiall y cripple the energies of labour , and deprive the werkmen of a considerable portion of that employment which at present ecarcely sufficed for their subsistence . With respect to the foreign trade , the proposed bill was the maddest project ever thought of . Why , the foreign trade so much exceeded ttic con .

      sumption of this country , that reducing the hours ot labour would destroy more than the entire ot our home consumption . Besides , this bill wai introduced at a tims of European scarcity . Was this a moment to say to the workman , " You shall not work , " when provisions were at famine price , and it required all bis energies to scramble fora subsistence ! ( Hear , bear . ) He had high authority for deprecating tho proposed measure . On the 1 st of July , 1839 , the noble lord the First Lord of the Treasury ^ speaking on the motion ef Lord Ashley , « aid , — " Did the' noble lord mean to fix the wages while ho curtailed the hours of labour ? If he did , he meant to do what was impossible ; if he did not , the committee must know that to shorten tbe hours of labour , at a time , too , when provisions were so dear , would be

      inhumanity . Therefore , he must vote against the measure . " ( Hear , bear . ) Wh j had ths noble lord changed bis opinion in 1847 ! Were provisions lower ! were times better t ( Hear , hear . ) Another reason why thei should hesitate in passing this measure was the bad success which had attended former interference . Thisupporters of the bill said , "You have interfered already ; it is only a quest ' on of degree , why not go further ! ' In bis opinion that was a reason why they should not go further . Every former interference was promised to be final , but it only created a necessity for further inteferanc * . Lord Ashley bad put forward garbled , statements in defence of the measure . In the

      evidence Uk « n on the subject , working men had given proof that they were not opposed to long hours , and clergjmen had stated there was nothing in factory labour injurious to health and morality . The working men were acting under a delusion . He believed that if they were convinced that reduction of labour must be attended with reduction of wages , they would reject it atouce . This meawt « v » ouVd not Bcttk the question , it would never be settled while the working classes were exposed to periodical distress , and consequently discontent , and therefore be trusted that tue house would reject the bill . He moved that it be committed tbat day six months .

      Mr . Beckett opposed the amendment . He believed that the operatives were sincerely anxious for the success of the bill . ( Hiar , hear . ) They had discussed it in their clubs andovsr their pots of ale , and they were convinced that prolonged labour was most injurious to the constitution . They were supported in this view by many of the manufacturers , who had petitioned in favour of an Eleven Hours'Bill . ( Hear , hear . ) He was inclined to support that view himself , for although he should prefer ten Hours , yet he was unwilling suddenl y to disturb lOMg . established Mjstema . An Eleven Hours' Bill would be a great improvemmt ; it would take off the last hour of toil , and permit the workmen to spend sometime among their families . It would also enable them to attend evening lectures , schools of design , and other educational institutions . The potitioners to whom he alluded had tried eleven hours , it had worked well , and wages had not diminished in proportion . With these views it was bis intention to support tbs bill .

      Mr . Waiid said tbat the house bad frequently advanced and retreated on this question . First , the motion of the noble lord the member for Dorsetshire was curried by a small majority ; and no looncr was it carried thnn it was reversed . Last year , after a full discussion , the measure wns negatived by a majority of ten ; and this year the second reading passed by a majority ot 108 . The house then divided in favour of a Ten Hours' Bill ; the hon . member for Leeds now proponed a meswo tennine , in the shape of an Eleven Hours' Bill , hoping thereby to settle the question . He ( Mr . Ward ) did not believe that it could thus be settUd ; his honourable friend tho memher for 01 dh « m would not nccepUuch a settlement . ( "Hear , " from Mr . Fielding . ) The whole question was , could they pass the bill without reducing wages ? If

      they thought they could , if they were certain of it , he would go the whole way with them and vote for a Ten Hours' Bill . He knew that ia the view he took of this question , he differed from many of his constituents and from several members of the government , but lie had the deepest convictions as te the course he ought to take He had last year pointed out the danger of encouraging delusions among the working classes , awl also Unit the house wasgiving a legislative sanction to tbe proccdings of the trades' unions . He believed that there was not one of the working men who would take n Ten Hours ' Bill if they were sure of a reduction in wages . ( Cries of " Oh , oh , " and " Hear , hear . " ) Let them be asked , and hiB statement would be found to be correct . He was quite willing to admit that in ono town , where short time ^ had been tried , it hail worked well hitherto , aud had produced temporary advantages to the working

      classes . By arrangements amongst themselves wages had boen kept up ; hut tha quotton was , could this be done permanently ? In hardware , cotton , nnd others of our most important manufactures , two or three per cent , would turn the scale against us in neu > ral markets . As to the argument about the ingratitude of the free traders in refusing this boon , us it was termed , to the operatives , it must be remembered that free tr . id « was not a name merely , but a thing . Free trade was a measure , the benefits of which would devcloprtlicmsplvos gradually , not atonce . lie should give his vote iu favour of delaying the operation of , or if possiblo rescinding the vote to which tbe house had , as he believed , mostuuudvisedly come the other day ; for , of all times , he thought that the most unhappily chosen for an experiment of this niture , when the ecsreity and high price of cotton was occasioning a diminution in the demand for labour while th « price of provisions was riling , He must s » y

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      this was a most unhappy time to attempt by enactment to limit the hours of labour . Mr . Bbothertoh contended tbat the question for the house to consider was whether females and young persons from 13 to 18 years of ago should be compelled to work thirteen hours every day in b foetid atraosphero without relaxation % He could of his ow knowledge say that the operatives themselves were generally in favour of the measure —( hear . ) He admitted that it was most desirable for the state to avoid as far at possible interferinff with the employment of labour . But if the House of Commons were to leave everything to the rulei of political economy , their labours would be very much curtailed —( hear , hear . ) They interfered with these rules every day . They had interfered with , them in their

      ltgiilation as between landlord and tenant—master and apprentice—shipowners and seamen , and in a hundred other cases —( hear . ) Political economists argued against all legislation on the subject of factory labour . Why , then , was a factory bill ever passed 1 Because it was found that working in factories was an exception to thn general rule . When , in 1815 ; the late Sir' It . Peel brought forward his bill , it was ascertained that many of tbe mills were kept running seventy to ninety hours a week , and that children of six years of age wer » often comptlled to w > rk tbat number of hours in the same time . That , the house thought , was a sufficient ground for departing from tbe rules of political economy and interfering as between the employer and the employed . If all men were humane there would be no need of

      legislation—Or if they were to lay It down that the working classes were made to eat , to drink , to work , and to die only , they might then tafely leave thtse things to tbe strict rules of political economy . ( Hear . ) It was said , leave this matter to the parties themselves , and they will come to an arrangement , but had they done so \ Nothing ot the kind , nor was there any hope of euch a result , ( Hear , hear . ) It was in consequence of tbe preponderencc of females in factories that this further legislation was necessary . They bad legislated to protect the children , because they were weak ; and they must now , for the same reason , interfere for tbe protection of the females , In factories , the weak worked tide by side with the strong , and , while the one might hear up against tha labour without inconvenience , the other

      would sink under it . When he was a boy , he knew what it was for the weak to work those long hours , by his own experience aj a factory worker . H » had feelings and sentiments then on the subject , and formed tho resolutien tbat , if ever be had the power , he would use his utmost endeavours to bring about a diminution of ths hours of labour for women and children . ( Cheers . ) And he was proud to saj that this feeling of his boyhood wa « retained in his elder age . ( Hear , bear . ) He did not aecus * the masters of inhumanity in working their hands long hours . Cnpital and labour were so combined , and competition was so powerful , tbatlt wasimpossiblefor any master to resist the temptation to do so , unless all were compelled to take the same course . Even the honourable member for Oldham , rich as he was , were he to carry

      out in his own mills the humane principles he advocated , would , unless there were a law requiring all to do tba same , soon be In the Gazette . ( Hear , hear . ) The working classes would not be alarmed by the statement that a reduction of wages must necessarily follow a diminution in the hours of labour . They knew that the greater part of their work was paid for by the piece , and not by time . They looked to what bad been the result of former changes , and they found that whereas , during the last thirty years , the price of the goods had fluctuated mere than 40 per cent ., wages had not decreased more than 1 or 2 por cent . Nor did he apprehend the danger contemplated by the hon . member for Sheffield , in the falling off of our exports , as resulting from the proposed reduction in the hours of labour . The extra machinery ordered

      during the last year , would more than counterbnlance all sueh reductions . Tho prophecies of the masters as to the ruinous effects to our commerce of diminishing th « hours of labour , had Hot been borne out by tbe result of the previous enactments in that direction . On tho contrary , exports had gone on iucreftring , andlastyear we exported 25 , 000 , 000 of cotton yarn more than during the previous year . The export of cotton goods had also materially Increased in that , as compared with the preceding , year , The reduction of the cotton tax alone , which was equal to 13 d . a week in the wages of the operatives , would more than compensate the masters for any decreased produc

      tion consequent en a diminution in the hours of labour . It was a mockery and a delusion to tell tke working classes that parliament was anxiou * to promote their physical and moral improvement by establishing parks and institutions , while they were compelled to labour twelve o * thirteen hours a day . He did not believe the statement that if this bill passed—whieh he had the highest authority for sayi ng was uot to decrease wngeg , but to advance wages at the expense of capital—that the working classes would continue to agitate . He believed the measure would be advantageous t » all parties , and when the operatives once felt the benefit of it , he was convinced they would cease to be agitators . ( Hear . )

      Sir J . Graham had listened with much pleasure to the speech of the hon . member for Salford , the more so as he was not till then aware that , as a factory operative , he had administered with his own hands to his own wants . ( Hear . ) That circumstance reflected great honour upon the hon . gentlaman , and it afforded him ( Sir J . Graham ) not a little gratification to sit in that house with him on terms of perfect equality—( hoar , hear)—for the speeah of the hon . gentleman was of itself the most convincing proof that from the humblest classes of tho community gentlemen might rise to stations of the highest importance and influence by the exercise of honest industry and unblemished integrity —( hear)—but the course of life to which the hon . gentleman owed his success ha » been compatible with long hours of labour ; and he was himself a

      proof that , by caretul employmen t of time in that branch of industry they were now discussing , the most useful and . honourable acquirements were compatible with long hours of labour . The rigbt hon . gentleman then spoke at great length in opposition to the bill . Its operations would be to curtail the number of hours per day for which macliinery would run . It would also throw a ft reat deal of the older machinery out of employment . That machinery could only compete with such as was of more recent construction by running for twelve hours a day . If they limited its working to ten hours a day , such legislation would be tantamount to the destruction of valuable property , now yielding to its owners tbe fruits of capital and industry , by Act ef Parliament . Sir G . Grey admitted that thu passing of the bill would lead to a diminution of

      wages , what would be the condition of the operatives in the North , with their wages materially reduced f Such was the nature of trade , that , under the most favourable circumstances , oscillation must occasionally take place . Should they then prevent the industrious man , when trade was good , and full work could be afforded him , from working as long as his Btrength would permit him , so as to lay up what might be surplus wages for the time bsini , ' , to meet the exigencies of less prosperous times J A sincere sense of public duty compelled him to resist this bill , and his opposition to it was grounded upon the following reasons . It was , in the first place , a . tax < ja machinery ; in the next . it imposed a limit to the earnings of industry ; and in the third , it was a tax upon wages . If they confined its operation to the four trades mentioned , it would be most unequal and unjust , and if they intended it to all trades and occupations , it would be utterly intolerant .

      Sir G . Gbet . observed that he had never admitted that a reduction in the hours of labour , Buch as was sought by the bill , would necessarily lead to a diminution of wages . All that he had admitted was , that its tendency would be to diminution , but that there were other causes which might counteract that tendency . As he had observed on a former occasion , he would vote to go into committee on the bill , in the hope that the limitation imposed by it upon the houra of labour would rest at eleven hours ; but if it emerged from committee as * Ten Hours' Bill , he was ready to support it , on the third reading , as a Ten Hours'Blll .

      viscount MosrETH assented , as a general principle , to the desirableness of limiting the hour * of labour . He was fully impressed , however , with the necessity which rested upon them of proceeding In any such c » urse of legislation as was now contemplated with great caution and circumspection , and of tke measures which they adopted being as guarded and us experimental as possible . He was prepared to go into committee on the bill , in the hope that it would emerge from it as an Eleven Hours' Bill . If it did not , but was moulded in committee into a Ten Ilours' Bill , he could not share in the conn , deuce of Sir George Grey as to the non-injurious character of the measure so modified , and support it as a Ten Hours' Bill on the third reading .

      Lord Geoboe Bentiscs : regarded ten hours a day as the proper maximum of a day ' s labour . Tbegreat majority of the operatives in the country were in favour of tbe bill , in view of all the consequences to which it might give rise , and had he no other reason for supporting this bill , this alone would suffice to induce him to support the motion for the Speaker leaving the chair , Mr . Milneb Gibson delivered a long speech in oppositiou to the Bill , on behalf of his constituents , tbe Manchester millowners . He laid great stress on the differenceof opinion among tho supporters of the bill , and after running over the usual topics of the opponents of tbe measure , drew an alarming picture of the evils it would produce in drawing labour and capital from this to other countries , and aat down loudl y applauded by his party .

      Lord Ebmngtok was in favour of going into committee on the bill , but would move in committee to place all adult women out of the reach of Hs provisions . Sir R . Peel , who rose at ten minutes past five , and was indistinct and much more rapid than usual , spoke in opposition to tbe bill . When he presided over the Treasury , he sometimes excited a smile by saying that he hnd three courses to pursue . The noble lord who ftow occupied his place , had succeeded also to bis situation in that respect . Not only this , but the noble lord could also adduce tba high authority of a colleague for each of ths three courses before him . The Secretary for Ireland unhesitatingly declared his opposition to all interference . The Secretary for the Homo Department wa »

      in tavour of going into committee on the bill , in tho hone Hint it would emerge from committee nn Eleven Hours ' Bill , hut was quite ready to support it should it re-appear in the house as a Ten Hours'Bill ; whilst the noble lord , the Clnef Commissioner of tho Woods and Forest' had intimated his intention of sticking fast at eleven hours . The position in which tho noble lord thus found himself remtudedhimofa mathematical problem , very difficult of solution , which was , at what point a body would remain at rest when exposed to the attructiou of three great bodies . The noble lord had it now in his powsr to solve that difficult problem , and be ( Sir R . Peel ) wai curious to know whether tbe noble lord would remain at rat , or decide in favourof one or other of hit colleague *

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      t would be a narrow mode in which to deal with tbeT ^ ject , to argue itupon the strict rules of politol econo ^\ It was quite possible that the political ^ economv 7 S ? country had conBned itself to too narrow a range .. „!' cm ly when compared with tho more complex . ' cS ; which had been rendered by the Italian econom y * Thegr * und upon which he would give hi . vote anlnst 11 further progress of the bill , was the deep conviction „„ der which he laboured , that it would not be for tha welfare of the working classes ; that it would not b » for their intellectual culture or their social and intellect tual improvement , that they imposed restrictions on the hours of labour . There were many reasons too why it was positively dangerous to impose such rostric ' tionsat present . There was now no impediment to tha employment of British capital in foreign countries , tfnv more , it was by no means improbable that every tn . couragement might be given to its employment abroad * Besides , they must bear in wind that machinery was now

      fretly exported abroad , and in addition to this , the ex . tended means of locomotion which they now possessed * and the gradual disappearance of those prejudices which * formerly confined th « Englishman to his own country would lead to a largo migration of skilled labour , if im * pediments were to be thrown in its way at home . Thej had at presant , therefore , no control over capital , ma . chinery , or labour ; and yet it was under these circumstances that they proposed not only that women ani children , but , practically , adult males also should ! not work more than five days in the week . What would be the result of such a restriction aathis , in connection with the freedom of egress , which was now accorded bj the policy of the country to capital , labour , and machinery ! The right honourable gentleman then intimated that they should all aim at the social , the moral , and the intellectual improvement of the working classes , hut warned the house that if , at the same time , they d « prived those classes of the comforts of life , their improvement , in other respeets , would only render them the more

      dangerous to the peace of the country in times of commercial adversity . The real way in which to improve the hamu and elevate tlio character of the working cla 88 eB , was to give them a proper command over the necessaries ol life . It would be the " most mar . vellous thing that had ever happened , " and the " greatest phenomenon that had ever occurred , " if the employers , in the four great branches of manufacture , with which they proposed to interfere , should give six days' wages for five days' work , Thii

      could only be given in consideration of getting more work out of tin operatives , in a given and limited time , than the ; now got , and to compress six days' work into five days , so as to entitle tho operatives to six days' wages would be a greater strain upon their bodily faculties than to permit them to work six days for six days' wages would be , The poor man ' s wages were the poor man ' s income , and a deduction from the time in which thoio wages were earned would be the poor man ' s incomu tax —an income tax which would press upon him at the rats of from 12 tolG percent .

      It was now but a few minutes from six o ' clock , and the right honourable gentleman brought his speech , which was listened to throughout with the most marked ] attention , to a sudden close , by declaring that it wag because he firmly believed that the bill before them pro . posed a most unwise interference with the rights and privileges of the labouring classes of . the country , to whom he had often acknowledged his own " special obligations , " that he perse * ered in giving it his stream out opposition . The bouse then divided , and the numbers were For going into committee ,,, 190 For amendment 100 Majority fac going into committee 90 The house then adjourned .

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      THE FRATERNAL DEMOCRATS . Tho usual meeting of this society took place on Monday evening , March 1 st ; William Allen in the chair . Some town members haying been elected , tho following country members were also elected : —Joha West , of Macclesfield ; Adara Cameron . of Mauchline , Ayrshire \ Thotim Smith , «? BwiaiuguaiD . ; and Thomas Frost , of Croydon , Surrey . On the motion of Julian Harnev and Carl Schapper , William Allen , native of the United States , was elected American secretary . An important communication ( from Paris ) re * Bpecting the Prussian Constitution was read , after which the discussion was commenced on "Tho American National Reform Movement , for theestab * lishment of a Landed Democracy . "

      Charles Keen said , this movement showed that political franchises secured to the Americana by their revolution , had failed to establish social justice ; hence the necessity of social reform . He admired tha views seemingly entertained by the American reformers , as regarded tho equality of the' sexes , and the security of the homestead from the grasping clutch of the usurer ; but he objected that 100 acres was too much land to allot to one individual , or one family ; he also objected to the holders of the land having the power to sell their farms . He thought the land should not be bought nor sold . CablSciiappkd considered the American agitation defective . The land should belong to the people , and not to individuals . One hundred and sixty acres too much to to

      was give one man . Under soch a system , large as America was , there would come a time when there would be no land for the new comers , unless the farms were subdivided ; and the evils of subdivision were indisputable , lie wished the earth to be cultivated in common . Instead of isolating each family , he wished the land of the American townships to be cultivated by all , for all , Egotism was the curse of the human race : this curse would be augmented by giving each man his own piece of ground . Let the land be the property of the state , and all labour and all enjoy , and egotism would disappear . John Mot believed that while the land was held as individual property , equality was impossible . All partial relorms were objectionable , because the parties benefited by such reforms became Conservatives . The American reformers should go the whole length

      in demanding that the land should be made national property . The rental of the land should defray all the expenses of the state ; if this -was done taxes would not be needed . Buildings should be national property , as well as land . Railways , ga » -works ,. water-werks , &c , should be the property ot the state At present the public were plundered by private companies and profit-mongers , to a much greater extent than by tho government and mere tax . eatcrs . Geobok William Wueelir disputed the doctrine that partial reforms were objectionable . No doubt Communism , or the state of things desired by friend Schapper , was the great end of progress ; but the objects of the American refottaen contemplated » transition state , nnd their movement , in his opinion , was calculated to produce the happiest results .

      On the motion of J . Overton and Carl Schapper , the discussion was adjourned to the next meeting of the society , on Monday evening , March loth : J , Overton to open the discussion . George W . Wheeler was then elected chairman for the next meeting , and the proceedings terminated , [ The above report merely indicates the arguments of the speakers . The discussion promi&es to be very interesting and useful . At the next meeting tho election of members , and other business , will be so expedited a » to ensure the commencement ol the discussion by half-past 8 o ' clock . The chair to be taken at 8 . 1

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      Uhwholesomk LoBoiNos .--At the Shakspeare ' 9 Head , Wych-street , Strand , on Wednesday last , before Mr . Bedford , on the bedy of Jamet L&ban , aged Hi , an ivory turner . The deceased resided at No . 41 , Wych-street , and had been in great distress for some time past . He died suddenly on Saturday night last . The witnesses agreed that he was in a very destitute condition , but did not think that he died from starvation . Mr . B . Brooltee , surgeon , of Bedford-street , Coyent-garden , laid that he had made » » o «» mortemexflmination of the body , and found that the cause of death was hydrothorax , that is , water on the chest , lie could not help bringing under tha notice of the coroner and jury the filthy state of tha locality where the deceased resided , the impurity of the air , the want of proper drainage * nd tmffieient light , all these most uncongenial to a man in hisntate

      ot diMue . Ilis room was in a filthyjcondition , and destitute of the necessary comforts of life . After ten years experience as surgeon to the Strand Union , he nroii ^ at th L p , oor did not die " 0 often , « w ? mnn £ UT *^* " ? ° food ¦» f ™ th « ¦ £ Wt V * 5 bre » tned . He could not peafc in terms too condemnatory of the neitlect of Sli ^ -fT' "S"J Ufy turned » veSia accordance with the medical evidence . Food PO r Mir asd BiRDS .-The proposal has been made to cut off the oats which are usuallv eiven 10

      norses , and make bread for men : but there is another consuming class which is allowed with S ^' take the food out of the poor man ' s mouth . We allude to the hares and rabbita . Every rabbit consumes a bushel of wheat-ao says the calculation before us ; robling the farmer of his money and not benefiting the landlord . We think , therefore , when there is not a mouthful of too much food to spare , it would be as well to get rid of some ol these epicurean rabbits and ham and &o increase the stock of provisions . It would be a delightful item to read amongst the subscriptions to the : inshand ' . Scotch Destitute Fund :- " The Abolition of tho Game Laws . . 2 , 000 . 000 bushels of

      wueat . It would be only a small addition ( tho bushel of wheat being six shillings ) of £ 600 , 000 ! By the by , what has become of the Game Law Committee ? The membera require starting a bit , for they do nothing apparently but sit upon their forms , —Punch ,

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      tin ** . 7 " ' "' wtj of Westminster , at the Office , iii the same Street and Parish for tl u I ' roby William Hewitt , of N » . 18 , Charlea-Btreet Mr * udon-strect Walworth , in th . pa ^ k rf Bfc ^ ry . Set K . « the ; C . Mty , f Swrey , at tlw officV , So . u , ffilusUI ' IIa » M"k * t ' tn « City \> fW « u Satarfa , March fltii , 1117 . .

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      | i ) OUSC Of ILOltft . THDR DAY , Feb . 25 . LABOURING POOR ( 1 UELAXD ) BILL—On tbi motion of the Earl of Clarendon , this bill was reao a ' . first time , and ordered to be read a second time © i . Monday . So other business of importance was transacted , ^ TRIDAY , ¥£ » . 26 . The Royal Asstm was given , by commission , to the Destitute l ' ersons Relief ( Ireland ) Bill . Lord Stanley put a question as to the course intended to be pursued bj government with respect to the publu business of the honse .

      The Marquis of Likimwne , in answer , stated that thf necesity of getting the bills for thereof of Ireland pa » fer through Parliament . and the pi otracted discussion that ha < takeu place « n those bills , had prevented the Lower Hous . from making such progress in measure of a moregenera nature as would rtiable them to stnd up any bill * to that honse . The perma nent measures for the reliel of Ireland would be introduced iptothejlouse of Commons on the 8 tb of March , and as soon as they were ditpostd of , several maasuresofan important nature , chitfly relating to improvements in tlie penal laws and sanatory regulation * for the health of town * , would be btought in . The Lord Cbaxceiior stated that he had under his care measures relating to the laws of debtor and creditor . After some conversation of no importance , the home adjourned . MOXDAT Mabch 1 .

      GLASGOW POST-OFFICE . —Tho Duke of Moktbosi complained of the defective state of the postal arrange menu at Glasgow , by which letters which arrived there by an accelerated mail at eight o ' clock in the evening were not delivered until the following morning . The Marquis of Clasbicak ^ b admitted the inconvenience , stating that steps weia taking to have an evening delivery , if possiWe . labouring POOR ( IRELAND ) BILL . —The Marquis of j CiASKicAKDE moved the second [ reading of tht Labouring Poor ( Ireland ) Bill , after which the noble marquis briefly iUted its different provisions . Lurd Bbocgbax did not intend to interpose any objection to the bill , as he considered that a paramount necessity bad arisen for tbe violation of the law for which an act of indemnity was now required . No stub ¦ violation should ever take place unless such necessity could be plainly shown to exist , nor should it be continued a day longer than the necessity remained for it .

      Afcer some remarks from Lords Elleaborousb , Monteagle , and FitrvriUiain , The Marquis of Lasdidowne explained the delay which had occurred in applying to Parliament for the Act of Indemnity now before their lordships . Tbe pressure of other business of a more imptrtant nature to Irelaud , a * providisg for her immediate relief , alone pre . vented the government from more speedily pressing forward the bill , which he hoped they would now consent to read a second time . The bill was then read a second time .

      TRANSPORTATION . —Earl Gbet moved the first reading of two bills ; one for the purpose of amending the law as to the custody of offenders , ' and the other refining to Millbank , Paikhurst , and Pentonville pritona ; These bills were not of importance in themselves , but be wished to state that in moving the second reading of them on Friday , be should state wbat measures were in contemplation in consequence of the contemplated abandonment of the punishment of transportation . The house then adjourned TUESDAY , March 2 .

      LAW OF SETTLEMENT . —The Duke of Richmond moved for the appointment of a select committee to inquire into the operation of the Poor Removal Act of last session . He pointed oat tbe difficulties which had arisen in consequence of the interpretation put by the Attorney-General and the Solicitor-General on the wording of this Act—a construction which its framert had never contemplated . His Grace expressed his conviction that this statute should bo repealed , or a declaratory Act should be passed to enable Boards of Guardians to perform with uniformity whatever the law required of them .

      The Marquis of Lassdowse admitted that good parliamentary grounds had been laid for the committee , which he was willing to agree to . Lord Bbsughak agreed with much that had fallen from the noble duke , and deprecated the haste and slo-Tenliness with which acts were frequently ptssed about the close of each session , rendering it necessary to bring the terms of most of them before the courts of law , in order to have them interpreted , The motion was then agreed to , and the committee nominated . Earl FiTzwitLiAK then presented a petition from the county ofWicklow , praying for the government to lend its aid for the introduction of railways into Ireland . In laying this petition before the house the noble earl dwelt at some length upon the necessity which existed for the government to employ the people of Ireland in reptoduc tive work * .

      Earl Gbei was not sanguine enough to look to any measure winch government might devise for an immediate regeneration of Ireland . The foundation of all im . pro « emetitin that country must be the better and more extensh e cultivation of the soil . To that he looked with more hope for the gradual amelioration of the condition of Ireland , than to any great scheme of public improve , ment to which the government might be induced to lend its aid . Lord Mokteagk concurred with those who thought that it was to her own exertions that Ireland must eventually look for her permanent improvement . Nothing but extreme ignorance , however , of her present condition , could lead any one to insist upon her being left at this moment te her own unaided resources . Here the matter dropped , and their lordships adjourned .

      ? $Oti0c Of Commons

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  • Citation
    • Northern Star (1837-1852), March 6, 1847, page 8, in the Nineteenth-Century Serials Edition (2008; 2018) ncse-os.kdl.kcl.ac.uk/periodicals/ns/issues/vm2-ncseproduct1408/page/8/