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Northern Star (1837-1852), 6th July 1844, Edition 1 of 1, Page 8

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    • 3. 3at*tamrcta¥3 3EnttI%*nr*.
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      3. 3at*Tamrcta¥3 3entti%*Nr*.

      3 . 3 at * tamrcta ¥ 3 3 EnttI % * nr * .

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      HOUSE OF LORDS—Fbidat , Jttot 23 . Tbe lrJh Marriage BH 1 was read a second tJEe in ie H--nse of Lortls , a-tl ordered to ba committed on Frifi ' -y next . Tae Sutar Daties Bill -was . read a first time , and tr ^ ered to be read a seco : d time on Monday .

      GDTEienjEXT ZSPIOSJlGE . ITba Eirl of RaI ^ ob . presented a petition from Si 5 Er . r Mr-rni , complaining that Me lstu-TS iiad been opEatd by tfce Past-cffice authorities . Ihe Earl of Bafinor said , their Lordships "were bow -well acquainted ¦ with there proceedings , -which had been so nracb spoten cf throughout the country , -which prodnced sncfa a sentTal feeling of sh ^ me and displeasurea fefjinz in -which ( tfce 32 arl of Radnor ) most fnlly coscxiTfrd—ibear , hear-. He should not detain their lordships on that « c ? sicn by going into a minute detail cf all the dicmnstances connected with this opening of the letttrs cf Mr . Mi _ z n 3 , foi he sbonld 2 rave s full opportunity of going into the sni-ject at length on a future occasion , as he 'sraa about to give notice ofa motion connected ivith it on a subsequent day ; bat he -wished n&w to ask whether a -warrant had 1 ; en given for opening all those letters by the Secretary of Stite frr the Horns Department ?

      The Lord ChaxceixoB—Have yon given notice or the qs = si ; en ? The Z , itI of IUdsob . —No . The Loed Chascellcb—Then yon cannot require 82 answer now . The Dike of Wellisgtos—I do not kno-w the name cf the peKUontr , nor did I receive any notice from tfce 2 ? oble Bad of his intention to put the question . The EstI cf Badsob . said , tbe infiMtinsl from » boBi lie petition came -was Mr . MiE-ni , these rarce had been recertly so much before the pntlic r in consequence of his letters having been opened at the PostcKxe—cbeai , hear ) . That individual complained that great i- jury had been done him by the opening of his betters , and be prayed that their Lordihips" should

      tte fu } ject intft consideration , in order that they »_ " ght ? Knt the petitioner redress . He ( the Earl of l ? -i 2 Bor 5 therefore gave notice , that on Thursday Etxt be should move for the -appointment of a select committee to ir . quire into tbe practice of opening letters at ?" ie Pust-rSce , and particularly into the circumstances connected -with the opening of the letters of Signor Hasina , end other foreigners residing in England whose letters isd tefn opened at the Post-cfBce—inear , hear ) . Lord Beocgham apologized for having misled the Sense by referring tbe act by -which tfce ? a obnoxious procsedicss -were legalized to the reign of Queen Anne , instead of to the Protectorate . The very measure by -whieli tbe Post-ufiee "was eocstitnletl recited tte psTET uf pitTLnting treasonable zuinzspcxdexice as one of the reasons in favour of tush an

      establiehmsnt . Lord Ca ^ pbeI-I- saidj he had read tba act that mom-Ing , but fce iii « i not pnt the same in-ttrprttztion on it ai bis If oY-Ie sbc Lesrrsed Friend . It ttcs passed in 1655 by ODe of Crcai ^ eHs Parliaments , and it is said , that cne object of establishing a post-rfice "JFonld te to put down treason and improper correspondence ; but , he very mueh doubted- -whether it -was at all in tbe cont ^ scplatiDn of ibst Parliament to open letters secretiy , and to reseal and send them te the parties to vrhom they "were addressed , as if they had never been inspected —( hear ; . He doubted very much ¦ whether the sjstem cf espionage since es ^ blisbed -was at all in the contemplation of tbe framers of that acL He rather considered lbs object t © have £ een , if they found a

      treasonable letter , it ihonld be se-zsd suoptriado and brought in evidence against tbe person implicated thereby in any treaseuavle plot He doubted exceedingly whether His statesmen of that time , who , with all their faults , ¦ were men of great virtue , and this country -was much * idebted to them for tHe improvement of its : nBHtntioas ; ifi dcnbt&i exceedingly "whether they at all contemplated fiie pracace -s-cieb -was aftenrards adopted . No doubt , at a BDbEfrQ =- ^ t period tfee practice of opening letters and resealisig sad sending them pievailtd , and the great olgcctin tbe reign of Quean Anne -was to stop a practice so pernicious and dishonourable to tbe conntry . He considered that the Home Secretary h * d Beted illegally in causing a number of letters to be opened in tirtue of tbe same -warrant , the act requiring a separate warrant to each letter .

      TheIoxd Cha > celiob controverted this opinion , and Vwitttd L- > rd Caaspbeil -with negligerce in having , as Attomey-Gcneral , allowed a Bill to pass in -which the necessity ef a specific -warrant for each letter was not feasted on . Lord Dr > 3 iA > " said that the ordinance of Scob'e Tented tfce convenience of sending Ittttrs , and that the estabBshirg of a post tfnee -would operate to defeat ¦ Wicked and dEEj > fcroii 3 conEpirsdes against the peace sod safety cf •¦ the CoEimon-wtalth of England ; " tut it did ne : contain a word about foreign powers—( chrersi The first Ac * upon tLe ^ ai'jeet after the B-i-storation was the 12 ih CtarltB II ., sod that only-went to eKafeuEh a posr-cSce . TLc 9 th of Anne , limiiing thit ast ,

      dis-Cnctiy tsid , thaw tiitre EhoBlfi be an express -warr ^ it for " evtry sneb cpKnug , ' and ! ha » certaiaiy appeared to him to require iks . t tvery psrticalar letter Ehonld be oonsidtxt d sale unices it could be opened by im txpress 'Warrant from tfce Secretary of State , He beard with tfce grtsteEi RtisfectiGn what had just faUcii from his 2 foble EEd iAaratd Friend , for Le conld not dcubt , » hen tb £ iu'jtct "was Lroug ' nt prscticaliy before the House of Loias , or rstfcer the Gabicet , thai they would -jcrenvc it to be , nut a question of antiquarian histories or Acts of Parliament , but a question of what ought to 1 » the law sX the present moment , and of what was due to all tbe states of lie -world , and to tbe people of ^ England , ncder the circumstances of the present time . He -was satisfied that the If cble Date himself—if it

      » ere not that he might be thereby appearing to give up s coll « gue placed under a £ eriou 3 accusation—would frrirtg dc « n a measure modifying or entirely repealing ihs absolute power which now tatmed Vo exist —{ ctieerE ) Thatpowtr , however , was not ceijferred by 3 ny act of Parlismait ; it was ^ se umed ; it was taken for grafted , -and waB supposed to have arisen from that state neces sity -whuh made the Tiabeas corpus essential for the psxsoisal cbfcrty of tbe sni . jict , ana which was brought iaio question in ruKKfcer form , wfien gfcceral -srarranU Trere EirpDos&a to fee the law of the land . But no sooner

      "Were those -warrants brought before tbe judges than they one and all conceisEed them , and showed them tot to be tbe law of tbe land . Amongst thess judges were Xords Mansfield and Camden , * h e latter of whom tJbserred , mahis asw aio / ozdus . This aEFumed power in regard to the opening of letters was the assumpticn cf that state necessity , and of which , in fces , it was at the present moment , tbe oiJy relic He thought it was ona irhirh ought not to be maintained , and , on a more perfect acquaintance with tbe subject , be was sure thtir lordships would fce of opinion that it should no longer be permitted to exist—ihesr , bear ) .

      Some further discussion , in which the Lord Chancellor , Lords Campbell , Dgarnan , Brougham , and Clanlif ^ rde , tock part , ensued as to the actual txtent of the power -which the law at present vested in the Secretarj of State . Lord Babsob faid , the ? fcble and Learned Lord ( BronghnTTi ) bid been drawing their I ^ rdstup ' s ailention frcm the Msl qn = ± iion Lelcre ibem , -which -was not Whether one ct many letters should be cpsned , but -Whether this one gentleman had been ill-treated or not ? That gentiemsa had complained that bis letters had been opened for four months consecutively , and the question upon which be should ground a motion for inquiry hereafter was , whether tbia gentleman had not tsen injured and the law violated in his case . '

      —( bear , hear ) . His Jfoble and learned friend said , that if the Secretary of State or the Government at ~ home was reformed by some foreign Minister abroad , thxt a certain person here was plotting , be ought to be TraUhed . Xow , he held that it was for plots against tfcB realm ef England that tneh a person should be "watched ; for English Uiaisifcrs ought not to play the part of spies for foreign powers—( hear , hear ) . What -appeared to him most extraordinary was that those five 2 foble Lords opposite , sitting ail of a row , and the 2 foble and Learntd Lord on tbe woolsack , making Eix abicEt Minuters , sfcoald be so ignorant of this matter , at this most odious practice should bo put in operaoe for four months EgaitBt a most respectable person "Who was said to 1 « suspected of being a dangerous person , and that not one of those CabiQet Minister * should know anything about it— thear , hear ) . TThy discussions had been going on for the last fortnight upon

      ibis Eubject ; it bad been several times agitated in the House of Commons ; and twice he bad brought it imder the notice of their iardships in that Housfe , and jBt those Cabinet Ministers , le ^ iag as they nrast—acd fee was mest confident that the Noble Dake eid—that fhU was a most odious proceeding , yet not one of them -Bad made ixqeiry of their brother Cabinet Minister , tte Home Secretary , whether such was the case or not , —whether Mr . Vf- ^'^ h a man most respected and I -loved by all who knew him , bad bad this odious ana abominable practice put into execution against hia—( hear , hear ) . That was most extraordinary—{ hear , hear ) . He should endeavour to persuade their Lordships to make wme further inquiry into this matter ; * sd therefore , be uow gave notice that he EbouM , on Thursday next , move for a secret committee to investigate this Eubjsct —( cheers from both sides of the House ) .

      The Earl of Wischilsea , in order to keep the pnee of com steady , and to put down the agitation on tbe Com Laws , suggested the " establishment of n&tioual Jr . inmies throughout the country . lord TMOXXEAGI . B conaiderea tfce . suggestion , and fin speech by -which li vas accompMied , to be Oio Jfcrongest arguments be bad ever heard against the sliding Male . The Duke of Richkoxd thought that £ te but mode « t Xaepiag the price of eorniteidy wm to maintain the 4 Bbtisf law vsalttrod . S » nitfce dropped , after Borne farther ztaackB frea ifaBBadof Wjs * hilsix-Tin Cnaritablo Bequests' ( InZasaj Bin wu pused JbtoBgb Gonmittee . Tha Scotch Pariahes' Bill and County Bate Bill were met read a lecond time . " The Home tten adjourned .

      MOSDAT , JPLT 1 . M » Sngaia * DnHes * 3 fll "was read a second time . ^ A . discamaa took place on the motion ior the' third prariipg & fa * BlBhoprics of St . Asph and Bangor Bill ,

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      duricg which thp Duke of Newcastle informed U 0 Lord CHAiiCEtLOB . that he hid been guilty of an utwartby m- > . r ce avie to get rid of tbe Bill . The third r * aC 5 ng was consequently postponed , and the Bill was referred to a Sslect Committea .

      TUESDAT , JULT 2 . Tbe leading business was the third reading of the Sujar DutiE 3 Bill , on which a debate of considerable lenath arose . Tee ~ Ezt \ of DALHorsiE stated the groirndB on which the Government bad brought in this raeaBure , ¦ which were assailed by Lord Monteagle , as fcsing un-EtatesmEnlike and anti-commercial ; defended by Lord Brougham on the anti-slavery principles ; while Earl St . Tinctnt arjrued that a Bnfficient supply sf freelabour to the West Indies would have prevented tbe necessity for the me ? sure . The Earl of Radnor considered it a step in the right direction , bnt thought it a hardship to prevent sugar refining in tbe West Indies . Lord A&hburton Eupperted it , and the Marquis of Lansdowne commented on the uncertainty and , insecurity on which it proceeded . The Earl of Dalhousie replied , and the Bill was res . d a third time and passed .

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      HOUSE OF COMMOXS . —Friday , Jtob 28 . Mr . Koebcck save notice for Tuesday next , of a petition compiaininc of the mal-administratlon of justice in the Channel Islands . Mr . Thomas DrxcosiBB presented a variety of petitions , complaining of the conduct of Sir James Graham in causing letters in the General Post Office to be opened . In answer to Dr . Bowrinir , it was stated by Sir Robert Peel , that though not ofBcially informed , he believed that the rumour waB correct of the intention of the Z ^ llverein to place a higher duty upon British iron . Tbe British Q-nvenrrneiit bad remonstrated , and he indulged hopea that the intention -would be abandoned . DI 5 SENTEBS' CHAVE ^ S * B 1 X"L .

      The tMrd reading of the Dissenters * Chapels' Bill was proposed , which was met by an amendment by Mr . Colgnbonn , seconded by S : r R H . Inglis , that it be read a third time tbat day six months . After some observations from Lord Elliot , in support of the Bill , and speeches from Sir T . "Wilde and Mi . Shaw , the House divided .

      For the amendment 81 Against it 201 Majority in favour of the Bill 120 The Bill was then passed ; and , as it came down from tbe Lords , it ODly requires the Royal assent to become law . The House then went into Committee on the Bink Charier Bill , which , after a lengthened discussion on ita remaining clauses , -was nltmately gene through , and ordered to be reported forth tvith . Oa the motion of Sir J- GJUHiJ ! , the Education UilJ went through Committee , and was ordered to be reported on Monday . Tbe ren . Eining bus i ness was then disposed of , and the House adjourned ai a quarter to ten o ' clock .

      Momiay , July 1 . Sir Rcbfrt Peel staled the meaenres which the Government propose to carry forward during tbe present session , and those which are to be abandoned . The more important of those which are to be pressed ( after the Bank Charter Bill , and one yet to be introduced , as a coronary to it , for the regulation offuiure , not existing , joint-stock banks ) sre the Poor-law Amendment Bin , the Railway ' s Regulation Bill , Savings Banks Bill , Presbyterian Marriages Bill , and a variety of others to which no material opposition is anticipated . With respect to tho County Ccurts Bill , the Government will not make

      an announcement , nntil the Honse of Lords come to 3 decision on ihe principle which is to be adopted on ¦ the subject of Imprisonment for D bt . Amongst ; those bills which are to be dropped , are the Irish Reg i stration and Franchise Bill , with its companion the Municipal Corporations Bills , and the . Ecclesiastical Courts Bill , the announcement of the postpone-: ment of which iras marked by significant cheering . , The Committee which vras appointed to inquire into , the subject of tbe jurisdiction of tbe Hcusa with i respect to contested elections , have reported , suggo >! ing certain alterations to be made in the law ; 1 and a bill wiil be introduced to give effect to their recommendation .

      Oa the order of the day for the second reading of the Irish Registration Bill , Mr . Thomas Duxcombk objected to thi 3 useless was : e of time with a Bill which they did not intend to pas 3 during the present session . If any Irish . member proposed that it should be read a second time tba : Gay six months , the G&verrment would object to it ; yet practically they were doing the same thii'g . He wa ? informed that there was a sirong feeling in Ireland against proceeding with the Bill , and moved , as an amendment , that the other orders of the i ay bo proceeded with . Sir Robert Yssi . said he had postponed the Second reading of the Bill from an early period of tbe session , at the exoress wi ~ h of Irish members . _ The princrplt s oi the bill was the same as that of the £ ngii .-h Registration Bill ; and he therefore persisted ia asfcing for a decision upon it , leaving dttaih for next session .

      _ A . di . 'tuesion eBsued , in which Mr . Vernon Smith , Lard £ : iot , Mr . Morgan J . O'Connell , Mr . SceiJ , Mr . Btrnal . Mr . Shaw , Lord Palmerson , and Mr . Collett , touk part , after which Mr Cueteis made a few observations to the thunder storm then passing over the Hou ? e . Sir Robebt Peel hoped Mr . Curteis was not afraid of a flash of lithtning , more especially as , being an agricultural mtmber , he must be s ;] ad of the rain with which it was accompanied . Bad be voluntarily postponed the second reading of the Bill he would have been taunted with another "insnlt to Ireland : " but be had no desire to press it , against the general feeling of Irish Members .

      A number of Irish 3 ! embers on both sides of the House successively made a few observations each , " and then , after Sir Rtbsrt Peel and Lord Eliot had reiterated tbat the postponement of the debate originated not with them , but in deference to the general feeling , the order of tbe day for the second reading of the Irish R ^ jjistration Bill and for the committee on the Municipal Corporation Bill , were discharged , both measures being thus abandoned for i the present session . : The Honse then proceeded to " the other orders of tbe day , " fixing the more important on the list for , future days . The first that wa 3 tak < n was the Committee on the Unlawful Oaihs { Ireland ) Bill , which is proposed to be renewed for another year .

      Mr . Moke OTerrall raised a discussion on a clause of the Bill which makes the possess-ion of copies cf illegal documents , penal , unless the individual can prove that he was ignorant of their nature and purport . As the power had beea abused for improper purposes , he moved , as an amendment , the omission of the words conferring it . Several members addressed the Committee . Sir James Graham gave the history of the measure . It originated with the late Government , its object being the suppression of unlawful societies , wbich be believed still existed in Ireland . The power waa an extreme one . and could only be justified by extreme circnmsiances ; but it was necessary to render the Bill tffeciive . And as the measure was only to be renewed for one year ( having been originally passed for five years ) there was less occasion ior that constitutional jealousy which he admitted wonld otherwise be rightly directed against it .

      Sir . More O'Ferball saw no necessity for the renewal of the bill at all ; and opposed its farther consideration , by moving that the Chairman should report progress . Lord Eliot and Sir James Gbaham protested against this . It had been admitted that there were unlawful societies in Ireland , and the Government were responsible for its tratquillny , which the opposition were free from . Colonel Rawdon repelled this tannt ; and after observations from other members , there was a call for a division , the Ministerial benches beiag thinly attended , while tbe Opposition presented a fair muster .

      Sir Robebt Peel , however , rose , and addressed the Committee , anxiously watching the door , in order to see if aid were at hand , a number of members pouring in as he was expressing a hope that the House would " pause" before it rejected the bill altogether . On a division , the numbers were 58 to 40 against the amendment . The bill then went through Committee , and was ordered to be reported . The Prisoners' ( Scotland ) Bill also went through Committee , and the House adjonrned at half-past eight . Tuesday , Jtn . r 2 . Mr . Wallace brought on a motion impugning the conduct of two of the Scotch judges ( the Lord Justice Clerk and Lord Wood ) on a trial ai the recent Glasgow assizes , in May last . He argued , on the authority of ten of the jurymen , that the case bad been improperly stopped , and a prisoner allowed to escape from the due operation of justice

      . lne Losd Advocate explained tbe circumstances attending the case , from which it appeared that it had been given np by the pnblic prosecntor , on account of the failure of evidence , and therefore no other course remained but the acquittal of the prisoner . The complaint he attributed to certain grumbling- discontented jurymen , who fancied that an improper interference lad taken place . Mx . Wallace pressed his motion to a division when lie w&s supported bj 36 against US .

      TH * TOST OTFIC 8 S ? T STSTIII . Sir Bobxst Pszl then appeals to th * M Member * who « e Bstiees « f motion" ka 4 pr *« WtM « » f tkt o * e relatire to the Post-cffie » , to give w * y , ia order that it aught eome on , as the Gevecnasnt w « r « txcoedingly desirous of ¦ eeting it . A ( Utbou « tlMomiors this was aceeeded to , and After some conversation , tbe several notions preceding that of the Honourable Member for Finabury were postponed by consent , and Mr . T . Duxcohbe rose and proceeded as follows : I must tender my thanks to those Honourable Gen * tlemen who have given me precedence i but with regard to the anxiety expressed by the-Right Hod . Baronet to proceed to a discussion of my motion , I

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      must take leave to observe that I did not perceive any anxiety on tho part of the Members of Her Majesty ' s Government—( hear , hear ) , or any of the officials connected with them —{ hear , hear ) , to attend here and make a Hou < e—( hear , hear ) , to give me the opportunity of bringmg the question again before it—( hear , hear ) ; for not a single Member of the Government was in his place ia this House a t four o ' clock ; and yon , Sir ( the Speaker ) , and y ' ju alone made tbe House by completing the requisite number of forty—( cheers ) . But I am glad to Uear from the Right Honourable Baronet that be is anxious tbe question Bbould be brought forwavd and fairly entered upon , and I hope he will testify that auxieiy by at once granting the inquirv

      I ask for—( hear , hear , and laughter ) . Tlie Right Honourable Baronet says—and I fully concur with the observation—that the public require to be satisfied as to the truth of the charges which have been made ; but the only way to satisfy the public is to accede to a full investigation of the question —( hear , hear)—which has been eo much canv 2

      should be brought forward the first thing to-night , instead of leaving tbe matter in doubt until now , when many Honourable Gentlemen have left the House , conceiving that , as so many other motions stood before it , it would be impo&ible for it to be brought on bsforeniue or ten o ' clock in the evening . But , Sir , I concede to the Government all the benefit they camleriYe from taking the House and myself at a oiFadvantage in this respect —( hear ) . It will bert-co ' uected that the other night 1 was accused of taking The Right Hon . Baronet the Home Secretary ( Sir J . Graham ) ty surprise . I think I may now complain in mj turn of bting taken by surprise by the course the Right Hon . Baronet has

      nursued—( hear , hear ) . I know nor , Sir , whether the whole representative system is to be get aside , upon every fuestion brought forward in this House which it may be inconvenient for the Government to meet , by their treating it as a question of confidence—( hear)—and calling upon their supporters to regard it not with reference to its own merits , but as a question of confidence or no confidence in the Government —( cheer 8);—for that is the way in whioh inconvenient questions , involving tho character of the Government , have been met lately , and a most unfair and unconstitutional way it is—( cheers ) . I say the Government have no right to treat this motion as a vote of want of confidence . I am aware

      that many gentlemen may vote upon H as a question of confidence in ihe Government , but I know also that many who vote against my motion on that ground are very often compelled to vote a confidence in the Government whioh it is notorious they do not feel . Now I want this question to be treated and stand upon its own merits , and its own merits only ( hear , hear ) . I do not know whether any other answer is to be given to those parties who have been injured by their letters having beeen opened end pryed into than they already received from the Right Honourable Baronet , tho Home Secretary . 1 know not whether they are to be toid again that they may seek redret-s in a court of law . Of all tho answers that have been given to these complainants whoae case I have

      submitted to the House , that of the Right Honourable Baronet ( Sir James Graham ) has been generally considered the most unsatisfactory and unworthy of a minister of the Crown —( hear , hear ) . Why , who is to be the defendant—should Mr . Mazzini , or any of the hundreds of persons whose letters have beea improperly opened—for there can be no doubt tbat hundreds of letters have been opened—with tbe-authoruy of tho Home-office in the fame way—who is to * be tbe defendant , should these partita or any of them bring their action—and who their witnesses 1 Is the Right Hon . Baronet , the Home Secretary , to be the defendant , or tho Postmaster-general ? and , if either of them , th'jn who is to be tho witnesses to prove the case ? the

      Right Hon . Baronet ' s subordinate , or the subordinates of the Post-office— ( hear , hear , hear ) ? Why , what ckance would there be of success in an action brought by a private individual against a Minister of the Crown , who would be defended by the law officers of the Crown , standing on mere technicalities of the law , throwing upon the party complaining the onus of proof , and that in a case where no legal proof can bo got at , but where tbe moral conviction is strong enough to satisfy the whole country ?—( hear , hear ) . I say , then , that answer of the Right Hon . Gentleman was unworthy of a Minister of the Crown . These parties wish the question to stand fairly before ihe House and the country upon its owd merits , and they appeal to tho

      representatives of the people . lhty say , let tbe conduct of the Government bo tried at the bar of public opinion ; we are not going to an attorney ' s office to try a case such as this—( hear , hear , hear ) . But thia is no longer a question between the Right Hon . Baronet the Home Secretary and Mt . Mazzini —it is now a question between the Right lion . Baronet and the whole people of England—( hear , hear ) . A breach of confidence has been perpetrated at the General Pcst-ofiice , aud the motion 1 shall ha re the honour te submit , is for an inquiry into the general system under which such proceedings take place . Tbe House has already refused to enter into the specific complaints of Air . Mszzini , and Captain Siclzman , the Polish exile ; and the question I

      have now to snbmit is for an enquiry into the whole system uader which the letters of the public , or of suspected pirsons , are opened at tho Post- ' ffice ; and the motion with which I intend to conclude is for the appointment of a select committee to irquire into a department of her Majesty ' s General PostofSce , commonly called " the Secret or Inner office , " the duties and employments of the persons engaged therein , and the authority under which the functions of the said office are discharged . And I shall , in addition to the words of the specific motion which I lately proposed to the House , subjoin the words , " and that tbe said committee shall report lo tho House , as well upon the expediency of making any alterations upon the law under which the said

      delaying and opening of letters takes place —( hear ) . Although , Sir , themotionisofamoregeneralcharacler than that proposed on another occasion , I distinctly state that 1 do not retract one single oharge which I then made against the Government , relative to the detention &nd opening of letters . An infraction of the law has been committed , and I then said — what , Sir , I now repeat—that tho power which was invested in the Government—for I will not fix my charge upon any particular member of that Government—I will not say that tho Right Honourable Baronet the Secretary of State is alone and personally responsible , the whole of tho Government must answer to the charge—( hear , hear , from Sir Robert Peel ) . 1 say then , Sir , that within

      the last two year 3 there has been a most unscrupulous use made of the . power invested in the Government—that it has been exercised to a . vtry grcal extent , and I belieye that if an inquiry shall be instituted I can prove that , so Jar from the Right Hon . Secretary for the Home Department having done cn ' v what every Secretary of State from the time of Q , 'ieen Anne has done before him , more letters have been opened within the last two years than within the preceding ten or even twenvy years , and that , sir , contrary to law—( loud cbeer ?) . In the first place then—in the establishment into which I wish a strict and searching inquiry to bo madethere exists an office which is called—that is which is known to the subordinates of the establishment by

      the name—an office which is called the " Secret , or Inner office . " In this office deeds of darkness take place—( hear , and a laugh ) . It is a port of Star Chamber—a sort of Post-offico Inquisition —( hear , hear ) . I am informed that sometimes the letters of individuals only are carried to this office , the ordinary officials at the Post-office being ignorant of what is done with them there , but from whence a messenger is sent to the Home-office with all that , is deemed valuable in their contents . Sometimes , I understand , a whole bag of lexers ia taken to tho secret room , a messenger is in attendance from the Home Office when the mail arnve 3 ; he says , " Give me such a bag—I want the Dublin bag , or the Brighton bag , " as tha case may bo . This I have

      been informed of , and this I am ready to prove—( cheers)—to prove that these bans , so called for , have been taken to the secret office , kept there for an hour or an hour and a half , and then carried back to the sorters , for them to perform the usual dnty upon . These sorters say they do not know what has taken place ia the secret office , with respect to these bags ; they do not know how many letters have been read or examined ; but that the bags are kept sometimes for an hour , sometimes for an hour and a half , and returned into the general and public department—( hear ) . As to the warrant of whioh the Right Hon . Gentleman has told us , I have not seen it , and he would not say anything about tbe parties with respect to whose correspondence it was used ; but I

      understand that it is incapable of contradiction , that at this moment—that day after day—the letters of the foreign ministers are opened and read ; that they are carried into the secret office ; that they are there read and examined ; at all events , that they are taken aw&j from those persons to whom they were first delivered , and tbat although no one can tell exactly what is then done with them , that it is pretty well known in the Post-office that these letters are read , examined , and extracts made from them before they rtach tht hands of the foreign ministers t » whom they ar « addressed—( hear , hear ) . Now , bit , I want

      t * kitwif tie MiniiUrB ar « awaro * f this . If it is trme—ifyom are guilty—then I say , that such practi «* c ar * a fosl it » in ¦*•» tk « koaomr of thia country —(««•«•)—and ft foal ataim it ia considered in France as well as in England , if the speech be faithfully reported which M . Guizot made the other day in the Chamber of Deputies . I quote from last Saturday ' s Guligncmi ' s Messenger . M . de Malleville , speaking of the subject of the recent opening of letters in this country , said , with reference to his own Government ;— "The ministors probably will be obliged to me for giving them this opportunity of declaring , in tbe meet

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      public manner , that the privacy of letters is respected by law and in fact ; and it is to the honour of the government of July to have shut the Cabinet Noir , and I sincerely hope it will never be re-esta' olished . " M . Guizot , tho Minister of Foreign Affairs , replied : " The Honourable Member who has j list spoken is quite in the right . In law and in fact , the privacy of letters is completely respeoted in France , and we have not thought it necessary ( nor can any one think it is so ) to contradict all the I errors which may bo uttered in respect to thiB , either in England or elsewhere . " This is the statement of the French Minister of Foreign Affairs —( cheers ) . I tako it as his official declaration , and am bound to believe it is true ; and , therefore ; what I said here— I

      when I stated that , " although such practices might suit , the air . of France , of Prussia , or of Russia , that they | would not suit our free atmosphere , "—I beg to retract—< hear , and a laugh ) . I apologise to the French nation , to M . Guizot and his Government , for such an aspersion upon their character—( bear , hear , and laughter ) . Sir , we are now , I think , beginning to bring the question into a somewhat narrow compass . I said upon a late occasion that this was an un-English custom ; but it seems that it is a peculiary English custom —( bear , and a laugh ) ; and we are quite alone in the way in which we practise it . ' In Austria , in most cases , nine times out of ten , indeed—when letters are opened , they are stamped with the Government seal , by which it is .

      known that they have been so opened by authority . I hold in my band the proof of this . The Hon . Member proceeded to read a letter as follows : ^ - In the month of May last , a merchant-ship , having on I board letters from Madrid , touched at a Dalmatian ' port . The Austrian authorities came on board , took : the letter-bag , opened it , opened the letters , read themi sealed ihem with the official seal—the double- ; headed eagle , thus marking them as opened by authority . " The Hon . Member proceeded : " Ferdinand , the . Grand Duko of Tuscany , after perusing letters detained at the Post-office , had them marked Ferdinamtus vidit . " Now , 1 will undertake to say , that no letters passed through our Post-t-ffioe , and j which have there been opened , examined , repealed ,

      and forwarded , have been ever marked as having b&en opened by authority —( hear ^ hear ) . It has been said in another place , that as to Mazzlni's case , what dees it all amount to 1—that only one warrant had been issued for the opening of only one letter addressed to that gentleman , and the Right Hon . Baronet opposite refused to etate whether other warrants had been in operation . I do not know what we may get out of the Right Hon . Baronet this evening , but hitherto we have had little enough—( a laugh ) . 1 rather think however , that he has said bo much , that tie must su . y a little more—( cheers ) . But from what appears in this day ' s papers wo have more light thrown upou the extent to which the system has been curried . I alludo to the letter of a

      correspondent of the Morning Chronicle , published this day . His name , I believe , is known to the conductors of that journal , and his character as a most respectable mail . Ho states , then , Sir , as follows : — " The Duke of Wellington denies that Mazzini ' s letters were Opened at the instigation of the Sardinian government . I am cominced , whsu his Gruce made that avowal , that he folfc couvinced of the truth of it . But I can bring forward proof that tho letters of this individual were detained and opened and copied , which copies wers handed to the Sardinian embassy at the request of an individual connected with the Sirdiniau government . This if , therefore , a play upou words . This is , however , no& all . The extent of this svstem is carried on

      wholesale , and perhaps rightly m >; btcauseif wo oblige one country , why should we not do the same to all ? What does it signify whether we open one letter or one hundred!—the stigma is tbe samo . The writor of tbe present letter has had several letters opened and detained , not even forwarded to tbe party ; and this at the request of a very small state , or , to be better understood , at the request of tbe Miniater , or somo connected with tho state as a * Koer-betwem . ' These letters being all relative to the subject , wore all detained— 1 should say supprtssed—oi no political character , but certainly of a grave nature as regarded the judicial proceedings of the place respecting an awful calamity . This is an undeniabls fact , aa slated to me hero by an authority , who

      charged me with having written about , certaiu matters , although I was so friendly with them ! &c . ia . I therefore trust tho country will insist upon expunging this statute from our code , and until this is done , I for one shall despatch my letters through other channels than tho Brinsh Post office , or , p ri ^ ent designation , Spy-office , —Hamburg , June 24 . 18 < 4 . " Now , it has been boldly stated , that only ono warrant had been issued for too opening of one letter , addressed to Mr . Muzz ' ni . This wai bialed by the Duko of Wellington to be all that , such a fuss was made about . S : r , I amprepared to prove that sixty or seventy of his haters"have been opened —that tho practice has been going on for two years in the most unscrupulous manner— ( heai , hear ) .

      During ihe disturbances of 1 W 2 , 1 understand that from this secret office , or Star Chamber , individuals were sent to the manufacturing districts—that they had a sort of roving commission , and that thoy went from place to place opening letters—whoso letters it was thit they opened God only knows—( hear , and a laugh)—iu all probability everybody ' s—( loud laughter ) . Now , under what authority did these people act 1 They , at least , could not have had a special warrant for each which tliey opened —( hear , hear ) . No ; ; thoy had a general ' order to &o into ihe manufacturing districts to collect information iu this disgraceful way — ( hear , hear , and O , O ) . Thtife men did go so about . It is notorious . They went from place to place opening letters . The

      provincial Post-masters wore not entrusted with this odious task , but persons from the General Post-office were sent over tho country . But there was some reason for tfa ' s , you may say—the period was ono of internal commotion . I grant it ; but were the whole manufacturing districts in a blaz >\ I should still atk whether you wero acting by authority and according to law in thus sending individuals over the country with merely a sort of general power ? I believe that there existed a wholesale system of letter opening at that period . I have been informed that such is the case , —and if tho eorauiiUeQ bo grafted I will prove it ; and ; sir , I say thia in my place in Parliament—( loud cheers ) . Sir . I say that the letter-bags are carried to the secret office when a bag is wanted

      fhafc no person knows whose letters are there opened but the officials of the secret department ; aud as to individual letter . " , persons come from that offico when the letters are soned , and in the bauds of the letter-carrier for distribution ; these latter are told to give over tho letters of such and such a person , or such a street ; for instance , tho secret official may say , " I want the letters of the Albany "—( cries of hear , hear , and a laugh ) . Now in 1842 a good many iloa . Members lived in the Albany . The Right Hon . Member for Edinburgh—( Mr . Macaulay ) , and the Noble Lord the Member for Newark- ( Lord John Manners ) , lived there . Howbver , at all events , this is the sort of wny in which letters were taken from the

      lettercarrier , and it is ofivn done yet . I presume that that will not be denied ; and if it is , I am the individual that will prove it—( cheers ) . The House may well understand the cifiicuhies 1 have had to contend with in getting at these secrets of the Postoffice . This I know , that , many of the oiliciala have been called before the Post- < fh'ce authorities , and have boen told— " Answer any questions at your peril . " They- have even be < -u txaunued aa to whether such and such & person has asked them questions ; and so at the priseut moment their lips are sealed . And in prpservinK silence they ar « probably right ; but BtflY , if a committee of this llousa wero to bo granted , they wonl < l rt-a / iily come forward , and would tell us the whole truth , and 1 am sure

      nothing but the truth —( hear , hear , and loud cheeis ) . Now Sir , my other charge against ihe Govevnmeiii id , that they have opened the letters of foreigners at the instigation of foreign power ? , and that to a very great , extent . The pracueo has not been confined to hi . Mazzini'scorrei-pondcnce ; but has been extended to that of Poles , and that of various Italians , in different parts of the country . And why has this been done ? What have wo to do with the internal disturbances in Italy—( hear , hear ) \ Aud what is the eonfcqtifnco of cur meddling with these poor people ' s correspondence \ How great ia the cruelty of the practice ! How little is it known by foreigners that England is guilty of such treachery —( cheers )! M . Mazzini received a leiter the other

      day from one of his expatriated countrymen ^ dated from Corfu , and he writes—but perhaps the Eight Hon . Baronet has seen to ail —( loud cheering and laughter from the Liberal benches ) . Well , he writes , tw Now that I have my foot upon . British soil , relying as I do upon the integrity of the English Postoffice , you may writo to me it » my own name " * relying upon the integrity of the'English Post-office !' Poor deluded man—( cheers ) . Well , he proceeds to congratulate himself upon being on British soil ; and he thanks many of those who had helped him to maso his escape , persons not suspected by , and probably not really hostile to , the Austrian government . Well , this letter is opened—its contents are handed over to the Austrian ambasaador—he sends a copy home ; and what is the consequence 1 Why , that those persons whose names are mentioned are thrown into prison I believe , indeed , that fifty or sixty persona are now in prison in Austria , with respect to whom it has

      begun to be suspected—as tbe web is ia process of unraveiment—that they are Buffering imprisonment in consequence of the degrading acts of the British Government . There is no habeas corpus in Austria , and so they may continue ia prison until « ither by torture , or length of cenfineme » t , they are induced to » ake ctnfttsiOB , ia the hope « f being rel «* s « d—( hear ) . I have said so much that I am unwilling to trespass longer « n th « House . Bat the feeling abroad is such that investigation ia absolutely required . The position in which the question now stands before , the public is neither satisfactory to them , creditable to the House , or honourable to the Government . The Government , if they went eo far as to say that they had issued any warrant , should have told the whole truth and nothing but the truth , and not attempted , as the Right Hon . Baronet had done , to mystify the subject , and ' . say that he had only issued a warrant with respeofc to one person , and

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      that the other three pet ; itl < mers had no reason to complain . Now , I say as to M .. Mazzini , that if it was necessary to ) examine his letters there is as much reason for continuing to examine them now aa when you issued the warrant—( hear , hear);—aud further , that you must have withdrawn the warrant because you were afraid of Parliamentary exposure—( hear , hear ) . As to the other three petititioners , you say that they have no right to complain . This is partially true , and partially not true . I do not believe that letters * addressed to them have been opened at the Post-office ; I have no proof of it : but of this I have proof , that letters addressed by them to Mazzini have been opened ; and I say , therefore , that if they have been writing about family

      secrets , they "ha vi a right to complain to the House , aad a great grievance to complain of . Let it be remembered that in thej eye of tho law the letters addressed tD Mazz'iii are tbe property of those who sent them until they shall have been delivered to him . Let me mention one more singular circum- j stance as to one of these letters of Mr . Lovett , as a ' proof that it was opened by Government . I have got some of them here , and the manner in which they are stamped ia a proof to me that they were opened as much as my eys am that the Right Hon . Bart , has got his hat on . Well , but asjto this particular letter . I may as well say here , that some of Mr . Lovett ' s letters were written as jtraps—we long suspected your practices , and so We thought we might try a !

      few experiments—( laughter ) . Well , ia this said letter there was a paragraph statiug that the Emperor Nicholas would soon be here , and expressing the writer ' s opinion that he did not think that his reception by the people ofithis country would be very flattering or very pleasant to him- Now , the very next morning th © Government prints made an attempt to contradict the report of the Emperor ' s visit . It was stated that he was not comine ; . I don ' t know if it was thought necep ? ary fo stiflo all hopes of our seeing the Emperor here , in order to prevent any reception the reverse of flattering from being prepared for him ; but however that might be , he did make hia appearance in five days , to the great astonifchment of tho ^ e who had believed the paragraph stating that he wo ! uld not come . Now , I don ' t

      say that this is a proof of the opening ot' the letter in question —( hear , hear , and laughter from the Ministerial benches)—but certainly it is rather a curious coincidence . I ; know the letter was opened , but I do not say that this i 3 conclusive proof of it —( liear , hear ) . i do not eay that it would be ! admitted as proof in the court of law to which \ the Right H «> n . Baronet advised the petitioners to go . Bat what , I want the Right Hon . Baronet to do is , to satisfy the public that the letters oi otherj persons not suspected of treasonable designs , are iiot unscrupulously opened , and that a gross breach of confidencs is not thus committed—( hear , hear ) . | Thia is a responsibility which the Right Hon . ijaronet should not shrink from . Looking at him as a minister of the

      Crownas a paid servant of the Crown . — a . s a paid servant , of the public—I pay ho is responsible . Considering that the Post-offico is a source of revenue—that you compel people to send their letters through it- and that , if thny do not , they are liable to penalties—I hold the Right Hon . Barcbet to be responsible . Do you coroDel people to send their letters through tho Po ^ t-office , that you may examine their content : — ( cheers ) 1 If you intend to continue this system of opening letters , you vaunt tell the people , cltarly and candidly , your intentions i can find no part of the Act authorising thus pnetica , justifying you in committing fraud and ; deception in re-sealing them . You are empowered to detain , delay aud opsn lettors , but you have no au hority for ro-seaJng them , and committing the ! frauds you do . 1 should he glad to hear what i construction the Right Honourable Gentleman puts upon the aci in ques

      tion . The Solicitor General is in his place ; and i hope we shall hear from him his opinion of the clause and statute in question . I wi * h to know if ho considers that a genrijl warrant only is necessary to open the lettors of all foreign ministers , and whether it is lawful afterwards tolseud down a mtre not « from the Homo offic ; -, directing that the letters of Mr . So and So shall be opened ? Sir , I maintain that this is a question which cannot rest where it is —( hear , hear ) . 1 hopo that 1 havo made out a primafacie case for inquiry— ( hear , hear , hear ) . Ii , will not do for you to entrench yourself behind the barrier of a soK ran official sihsuca ; nor will it satisfy the country that , you should be supported ia that solemn silence by a majority ready to carry you through any act of authority however odious to the people—( loud cheers ) . The Hon . Gentleman concluded by proposing his motion .

      Mr . Roebuck rose to second the motion ( as we understood ) , but considerable anxiety being manifested on both side to hear Sir James Graham , the Hon . Gentleman did not attempt to speak , but gave way to ; Sir James Graham , who spoke as follows :-S r , I am obliged to the Hon . and Learned Member for Bath , for not following the Hon . Gentleman who has just 6 at down , and I am sure that tho House will think that , after t-ueh a speech , I am , in justice , entitled touhearint ' . In the first place , permit me to say—and I bopo the Huuse will believe ray a ? suranue—that , on tho p : irt of her Majesty's Government , there was the utmost anxiety mat this question should not bo podtponeri—that ic Fhould bo

      forthwith discussed in a'l its bearings , and that a House should be made this evening for tbe purpose . Having issued a warrant I thought it my duty not to blink tha question in this H » use , hut to state frankly the facts as they were . Tne lion . Member expects that I shall again say to-night , that if anythiuK illegal has been don- % a ' egal remedy i ° open to the party wronged . S | r , thuu ^ h that may uot havo been a satisfactory answer , 1 cannot think it was an improper one . I feel strongly , that if any injury is inflicted upon a subject , the law provides a remedy ; but , at the same time , if the answer ia not satisfactory , I will not ito-night repeat it . The

      Hon . Member has also said , that this is a . question between tho people of England and the Government . Sir , whatever the question might have beeu , I will not say that it is not so now . I said , in the first instance , that it was an important question . I havo , all along , thought it ono of primary consequence , and in what I am how about to say , I shall so treat it . I admit , with the Hon . Gentl' -man , that it has now become a question between the people and the Government—( loud cheers from the Opposition benches ) . But the Hon . Gentleman said more , Ho says , that within the last two years a most unscrupu l ous use of this pewer had been made by the Government .

      Mr . Dungombe—I used ' the samo words on a former evening . Sir J . Graham—I beg not to be interrupted . No ono complains less of interruption than I do on ordinary occasions , but this is a grave matter , and I beg to be allowed to proceed . I was about to &ay that important as this subject really was , its importance had been greatly ' magnified , by the assertions of the Hon . Member , and by ih-j statement-. which have obtained circulation through the press ; and I will add that its magnitude has been enhanced by the bold assumptions on which the Hon . Member has vonturud tonight . \ The Hon . Member has said that it is not nous that as the mails arrive thero is a call from the secret office fii-t > t for the Dublin bag , then for the j Brighton ba «{ , then for bags for tbe different streets , and , in fact , he averred broadly that everybody ' s letter was opened . Mr . Dukcomiie—I said no such thing .

      Sir J . Graham : I am in thn recollection of the House —( hear , hear ) , but Iagain beg that I may not be interrupted . Now , the Him . Member , with ret ' ereuce to thf . se assertion : * , calls on . me to say more than I said on a recyut . f . ecayion '• he says ttiat I was theu trying to mysiify tho ilouso , and that it is my duty now tossy moro t-ban 1 then allowed to escape me . Now , Sir , I aril disposed to agree with tho Hon . Member that 1 mu .-t say more than I said bf fore— ( ironical cheers 1 ' rom the opposition benches ) . When I consider the state oi tlio public mind , always so sensitive on . atnaucr of ' thi- ^ sort—when I consider tho effort which has becn ;' niade , insidiously made , successfully made , ay , aad I will say designedly made , to it fluonco public opinion against mo upon

      this matter—when I r > fl-. ct on thus ^ things , I am led to agree with the Hon . Member that the time has come when I must say moro—when I ought to say more—when I will say more—when , to use the Hon . Gentleman ' s own expression , it is necessary , aud I am revived , tbat " tho truth , the whole truth , and nothing but the truth" shall come out —( loud cheers from the Opposition benches ) . [ He censured the unfa ivness of the course takeui in itie recent debate by the Members of the last Government , who , with their knowledge of the practice in all past time , had joined iu unjusrly imputing to him an improper departure from it . After the course they had so taken , it was now become impossible that thi ^ e powers could be hencelortti exercised without eoine inquiry whioh should

      s-atisfy the public mind on the subject of them . ] After the vote ot the Noble Lord ithe Member for SunderlanJ . after the vote of the jRighc Hon . G 9 utlcman tho Member for Edinburgh , after the vate of Sir George Grey , and ef others' who are equally conversant with the past praotice'of tho Executive Government—after their votes , 1 will say , that without inquiry the maintenance of ithis power in any way or shape whatever will bo utterly impossible —( loud , repeated , and protracted cheers from the Opposition ) ,-and , therefore , without any sacrifice whatever of public duty or public principle , —without any attempt to remov 9 _ from myself any degree of personal or public odium , I can now indulge my own private

      fealiags not inconsistently with my public duty , by consenting to be a party to a most eearohing inquiry —( renewed and protracted cheers from th « same quarter ) , —by fcaing a party to a most searching inquiry iate the state of the law , and of the praotiunder the law , from the earliest period down to the latest moment—( renewed cheers ) . As far as I am concerned , nothing shall be concealed—( loud and repeated cheers ) . I am prepared to go before a Committee of this House , the nature of whioh I will presently 6 tate , and declare all that has been done by me and under me . I hope that that Committee will call before them not only my colleague , the Noble Lord at the head of the Postoffice , but my predecessors , ! and his predecessors in

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      offioe , and that full and entire revelation will be ma . de . I proposo that that . Committee conduct its ! inquiry on terms so ample as to ensure full investigation . The powera given , under the law are not con * fined to England—to the Secretary of State—but they are given to the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland I hope the inquiry will bo extended to Ireland . I rejoice to think that before this Committee there will be no '' mystification , " and I hope the result will be ; satisfactory to the Hon . Member oppobite , and all who sit around him ; though certainly I intend to move an amendmeat to his proposition . ( " 0 , 0 V * ! and " Hear ") . Sir , I stated before , that I thought ! an entire revelation would not be for the public good i—( ironical cries of " hear ,, hear , " and " 0 ! " from

      | ! | the Opposition ) . I maintain . that opinion . I think that there must be inquiry ; but I think it should be I not before a Sslccfc Committee , but before a Secret Cottmittte , of this House —( renewed oriea of * "O J " i and ironical cheering ) . I think , following precedent , that it is a Secret Committee that ought to be appointed ; though I agree that that Committee should enjoy the most ample authority , and I desire to propose tbat power shall be given it as largely as the House or the public can desire . Much , I know , will depend oa the composition of such a Committee—( hear , hear ) . I am anxious that there should be no delay in its appointment . I know not if any will occur under the rules of the House ; but if those rules permit ife I trust that the committee will proceed with its

      inquiry forthwith . What I shall propose is , " That a coirimittee of secrecy be appointed to inquire into the law respecting the detaining and opening of letters at the General Post-office , and into the mode in . which the authority is exercised ; that the ccm * 1 mittee have power to send for persons papers , and records , and that they report their opinions and observations to the House . "—la cry of " names , 1 names" ) . He would propose that it should consist 1 of nine numbers , whom he named , namely , . Lord Sandon , Mr . Home Drummond , Mr . Xhomas 1 Baring , Sir William Heathcote , Sir Chares Lemon , j Mr . Warburton , Mr . Strutt , the O'Conor Don , and i Mr . Ord . This list excluded all the Ministers , as i being the persons accused ; and it excluded Mr . Duncombe himself , without any disrespect , but aa being , in a peculiar manner , the accuser upon this

      . Mr . Sheil suggested that a lawyer would be a useful addition to the committee . It the Post-office functionaries were to be examined , a forensic inquisitor would be useful in a thorough investigation-Sir G . Gbet disclaimed all'intention of being a party to any attempt at running down Sir James Graham . His own vote on the former motion had been given solely on the grounds that the power conferred for ono purpose appoared to have been exercised for another , and that on this head the Government had wholly refused explanation . He quite approved the resolution now taken by Sir J . Graham for a full inquiry , and he believed it might be advisable to mako the committee a secret one ; but ho thought it would be best to def ^ r the nomination of its memb rs until to-morrow . He agreed that the inquiry ought to go back so as to include former Governments .

      Mr . RoppccK , though doubting if the public would be satisfied with * secret committee , would not object to an inquiry with closed doors , but wished to ensure the full publication of the evidence when it was completed . It would be an inquiry , not merely into practice , but into law ; and it was desirable that the committee should be guided by some individual in wham the Hou ^ o could have confidence . He sympathised with Sir James Graham , who had been rendered an object ot bitter calumny for simply doing what his prodescessors had done before him ; but the power which the law conferred was obnoxious to our habits and feelings . Giving M . Guizot implicit credit for personal veracity , he doubted the correctness of his representation of French practice , aud read a copy of an official letter , written during the hundred days , showing that at least formerly violation of the privacy of correspondence was common enough iii France .

      Mr . Ladouchere declared that he individually , aad , not the late Government , was responsible for the consolidation ot the Post-office acts iu 1837 ; bat it had been a mere consolidation , without any change whatever , except the abolition of capital " punishment in certain cases , and , except that as to tho opening of letters , the form of words used in the earlier Irish act had been adopted , instead of the form used in the earlier English acts . He had no particular knowledge of what might have baen doae under this power by Lord John Russell , as Secretary

      of State ; but having perfect confidence in hia Noble Friend , ho did not object to any inquiry in which his Noble Friend ' s conduct might be involved- He thought it of great importance to preserve the feeling of the sanctity of a seal , but ho admitted that in extreme rases , as when danger to the life of the Sovereign wag apprehended , the letters of private persons nrght fitly be opened . He concurred in the opinion that the Committee ought to be a secret one ; but he wished the nomination of tho members to be deferred till the next day .

      Sir R . Peel cordially and personally n joicpd at fhe opportunity whioh would now be afforaed to the whole Government of sharing that responsibility for an invidious function , which ought not to rest indididually on the Secretary of Slate . The Government had purposely omitted lawyers ; they had not wished to originate a tquabbiing about legal constructions , which would have been regarded by the public as a diversion and distraction r ' rom the real object of the inquiry . The point upon which the people of England wished to be informed was not the point of law . An objection was made as to the proposal of secrecy , but without such a guarantee you would not obtain from individuals that hill disclosure which was so necessary to the present purpose . He pressed that the nomination might-ba immediate , tho rule which requires notice of the names in . the case of a select committee not extending to the ca ^ o of a secret committee .

      Lord J . Russell said , that on the former motion he had come to the House apprehending thai he should be able tosnpportthe Ministers , from whom he naturally expected some explanation of their general principles . He had , in fact , on that occasion defended the existence of the autherity ; but , finding it stated that the power had been used for purposes connected , not with our own , bus with foreign Governments , he had felt that , on the refusal of Sir J . Graham to give any explanation , however general , it waa hia duty to vote for the motion then made . He approved the suggestion of secrecy , and was willing to adopt any names whioh the Government might propose . Ha waa quite willing to be personally examined before the proposed committee . ( Gonlinued in our first page . )

      Untitled Article

      Leeds Corn Market , Tuesday , Jdly 2 nd . — The arrival of Wheat to this day ' s market is larger , w . th x fair supply of other articles . Wheat has b . en v . ; ry slow , and to make sales , Is to 2 s per qr low-v r . Oats \ to i per stone lower . Beans rather lower . The weather has been fine since last Tuesday . the avebage prices of wheat , fob the week endino July 2 , 1844 . Wheat . Barley . Oats . Rve . Beans . Pee * Qrs . Qrfc . Qrs . Qrs . Qrs . Qi ,. 3104 347 111 0 363 41 £ . a , d . £ s . d . £ s . d . £ s . d . £ s . d . £ e . d . 2 15 10 1 13 G ^ 1 1 Si 0 0 0 1 16 11 1 15 Of

      York Corn Mabket , June 29 . —We have little change to note in to-day's market , in comparison with what has bep . n doing for some weeks past . Millers are indisposed to purchase Wheat , except at a Hi tie reduction , in price , and Spring Corn , is not so freely dealt in as of late , though we cannot note any alteration in the value . We have had some very refreshing rain during the week , and Wheat is liknly : o be ready for the sickle earlier than usual this season . Malton Cork Market , Juse 29 . —We bate had a short supply of all grain offering to this day ' s market . Wheat m : t a dull sale , and was Is per quarter Icwer . In oats no alteration . Wheat , red t from 58 s to 62 d , ditto white , 62 s to 66 s per id stones . Oats , lOd to lid per stone .

      Liverpool Cattle Maket , Monday , July 1 . — We have bad a larger supply of Cattle at market today than last week , which met with dull pale , at the following prices : —Beef 5 % d to 5 d . Mutton 5 | d to 6 ^ d . Lambs 5 £ d to 6 ^ d per lb . Richmoivd Corn Market , Saturday , June 29 . — We h&d a fair supply of j ^ rain in our market to-day . Wheat from 7 s 3 d to 8 s 66 , Oats 23 9 d to 33 9 d . Barley 4 a to 4 s 3 d . Beans 5 s to os 2 d per bushel .

      WAKEFIELD CORN MARKET . Friday , July 5 . —We have a fair arrival of Wheat to this day's market ; the trade was exceedingly fiat , and all descriptiona must be noted Is . par quarter lower . Barley in request at former rates . Oata » Beans , aud Shelling remain unaltered in value .

      Leeds :—Priat«D For Th» Proprietor, Fe Argus O'Connoi, Esq. «F Hanuoeramith, Conat F

      Leeds : —Priat « d for th » Proprietor , FE ARGUS O'CONNOI , Esq . « f Hanuoeramith , Conat f

      Middlesex , fcy JOSHUA HOBSON , at hi * Print ' ing OffiM > , Noi . 12 and 13 , Mark « t-8 * Mt , Briggate f » d Published by the said Joshva Hobson , ( tn tha said Fxar «»« O'Comxok , ) at fab Dwelling-houe , N : 6 , Market-street , Briggate ; an internal Commnaicatioa existing between the said No . S , Market-street , and the said Nob . 12 and 13 , Market-street , Btiggato , thus constituting the whole of the said Print og and Publishing Offlo onePremisw . ( Saturday . July 9 , 1844 . J

      Local Markets.

      LOCAL MARKETS .

      Untitled Article

      T * THE NORTHERN STAR . Juit 6 , 1844 .

  • Citation
    • Northern Star (1837-1852), July 6, 1844, page 8, in the Nineteenth-Century Serials Edition (2008; 2018) ncse-os.kdl.kcl.ac.uk/periodicals/ns/issues/vm2-ncseproduct1270/page/8/