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Northern Star (1837-1852), 10th February 1849, Edition 3 of 3, Page 7, good 1*^^^^ * nm -^illifsJtf XT. _~ - »*...

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      Ijfbbtiuatiy 10, 1849. ^ ___- :: The Nor...

      _IJFbbtiuatiy 10 , 1849 . _^ ___ - :: THE NORTTTffiftM STAR .

      Hj Imperial Itarluunmt

      HJ _imperial _Itarluunmt

      F§§ Monday, Feb.5. Mhj---E Of Lords.—Lor...

      f §§ _MONDAY , Feb . 5 . _MHJ---E OF LORDS . —Lord _Forikscce , as Lord ____ of the Household , communicated to their _^ gffjt ,- - -cr Maj ? _sty ' s most gracious answer to the _nlS & _ldress of the Bouse . " _S _^ _f-m-nis of _UxsnowxE gave notice that , on _SfS he _should move for a Select Committee _^ p _c mto the _administnition ot the Poor law S _^ lf dnnan and Secretary of the North Wales £ Companv appearedat the bar in pursuance _WsSnriler of " last -session , io produce certain _llllents connected with the accounts of that

      com-• ap some discussion , in which Lord Moxteagle _-mjuiiiined that those gentlemen had been guilty of ateKKh of privilege in not producing the papers in -Sn before thi recess , the documents were or-Wmo be printed , and the parties directed to _atteaiEitt the bar on Monday next . iitWov the Coxstiictiox ix Ihelaw ) . —Mr . J . _SS | r ELL bc- _*<* ed t 0 call the attention of the House fellfdocumen ? which he held in his hands , and ___ S . nder the peculiar circumstances ofthe case , -Omi

      „ t , _""* " - ' * - "" I .,...- ! ,., _„„ nU _« f + l , r . nnri . bned would tum out to be a breach of the mm-Eofthe House , and a fabrication . Thi 3 docunurnnrted to have been presented to both [ es of Parliament by command of her Majesty , to contain a copy of a letter from the Lordtenant Of Ireland to the Secretary of State for lome Department , and he should conclude the _rks he had to offer by moving that William c ? _, the printer , be called before the House to or for himself and his instigators , for offering he ( Mr . O'Connell ) considered an insult to the

      Hie SrEAKER here interrupted tho hon . member , lb-formed him that a document presented to both _BSCS of Parliament by command of her Majesty , Id not be considered as violating the privileges of fllousc . lord J . RrssEU . begged te say , that the paper ferred toby thc hon . member , was an authentic foment , and had been presented to Parliament by hm-ind of her Majesty . _ r . J . O'Coxxell then said , he was reduced to ( necessity of moving the adjournment of- the use , and " supposed that he should now be pertly in order in proceeding with his observations . i , " oh !) Thc hon . member was proceeding _acdinirlv to insist that the letter was of an

      _unconsti-Itional and tyrannous character , when Sir . U . Drummoxd rose to order , and requested e opinion of the Speaker whether these observains related to the question of the adjournment _, lear , hear . ) & he Speaker was of opinion that they certainly Jhiot . ( Ilear , hear . ) _| Mr . J . _O'Coxxeix hoped it would be allowed that ley did , when lie went on to state his conviction Qi ii would be for the dignity of the House , with [ e liberty ofthe subject at stake , that they should BK > urn to £ * ive consideration to this matter , and be reiwred for the debate upon it on the next _night . Dii _* . oh ' ) If the House inherited the spirit ofits _re-ieeessors , and proved itself nobly jealous of thc Diistitution . it would consider whether there was Ot in this document grave matter for the impeachicnt ofthe noble lord who sig ned it . ( Oh !) The

      | _oi-le lord asked to have the constitution suspended p order that he might prevent the seeking a _constitutional object ; and he asked this under the pretence [ hat he desired to put down an ag itation which was _jroll known to be utterly extinct . He ( Mr . O'Conicll ) was sorry to say that he had not met with inich encouragement in calling , as he had been loins , upon English liberal members for help in _apposing thc threatened measure —( hear , hear ) ;—ret ihey would rather die than submit to it in _England , and if they themselves proclaimed a sepa-- . _izion in constitution , how could they blame the -retched insurrection of last July ? Had pot those wme claim to consideration who , like himself , in Ireland did all in their power to prevent insurrecioi ; f The Imperial Parliament , indeed , had Ireland _jader their foot now ; but " _bought can escape the vigil long

      { Of him who treasures up a wrong . Ut wa ? their hour now —( Oh . ' )—but the hour of Ireland might come ; and when it arrived , the people Ef Ireland would have thia measure in bitter _remem-Sii-ance , ( Oh , oh !) The rjl _* E . V \ fiR inquired who would second the motion , when after a pause of a few moments , Mr . Grattax said—I do not rise to second ihe motion , but I wish —( Laughter , and cries of " Order _, order . " ) The SrEAKEit announced that there was no question before the House , and directed the clerk to read the hsfc of members who had claimed to be excused from serving on election committees as being of

      ~ f-p *** a * - * 2 s of _sixty years age . The list was read accordingly ; and Lord J . Russell , Sir G . Grey , and the Chancellor of the Exchequer were also ordered 4 o lie excused while holding office . Sessional Orders . —Lord Joror Bussell moved some new sessional resolutions , with the view of accelerating the progress of public business of the House . The particular resolutions which may be characterised as substantially new are ( as afterwards amended ) to the following effect : — ' * That when any bill is presented by a member , pursuant to an order of the House , or brought from the Lords , the question that it 'be read afirst time , ' or that it be * printed , ' shall be decided without _del-.-ite or amendment ,

      " That when a bill has been partly considered in committee ( except supply or ways and means ) , and the chairman lias reported progress and asked leave to sit again , and thc House has ordered its sitting on a particular day , the Speaker , when the order is read , shall leave " the chair without putting the _question . " That at the close of the proceedings of a committee of the whole House on a bill , the chairman Shall report thc hill forthwith , and the amendments shall be received without debate .

      '* That the House will not insist upon its ancient undoubted privileges , in certain cases , with respect to any bill brought or returned from the Lords with amendments affecting any pecuniary penalty , forfeiture or fee . " Thc noble lord detailed the reasons npon which these resolutions were founded , and the advantages whieh mig ht he expected from their adoption , in expediting public business , without limiting the power of free discussion . Mr . Goulhurx , Sir R . Ixglis , and other members _susrsested alterations in the wording of the resolutions ; and Mr . Hume fell the pulse of the House as to the limitation of speeches—a proposal ,, he said , lie had made in the committee , but could get no member to second it ,

      At a later period ofthe _evenrng , however , Mr . M Gibson * interposed , and adopting a suggestion thrown out by Mr . Hume , moved as an amendment a resolution limiting the duration of all speeches to one hour , except in the case of a memher introducing an orig inal motion , or a minister of the crown speaking in reply . Some difficulty was offered to the putting of this amendment in point of form , which Mr . Gibson dexterously avoided by moving ik-omission of the whole of the original resolution except the first words , filling up the hiatus with the words of his amendment .

      Lord J . Russell saw much public inconvenience . 15 likely to arise from the proposition , and put the ca _" _-e of a charge brought against a government depirtment , ana supported % statements extending over a three-hours' speech . It would be obviously unjust to deny the representative of that department equal facilities to make his defence . If they adopted the hour limit , it should apply to all parties alike , or justice would not be done to the individual ; while if they limited every one they would _hai-dlv in all cases " do justice to the subject . Mr ! Ttxte thought the habit of long speaking -was owing to the growing - perfection of reporting , and su «< -ested that the evil mig ht be abated by

      shorteningthe reports . Mr . Hume considered an hour sufficient to say all that need be said on any subject . Sir 11 . Peel would rather leave the matter to the discretion of members themselves than lay down any arbitrary rule . If members would agree to avoid repeating facts and arguments advanced by others , much tune mig ht be saved . He hoped Mr . Hume would do this in future , and showan example to other members . Mr . Hcme was quite willing to enter into an _agreement never to speak longer than twenty minutes ifthe risrht hon . baronet would do so too .

      This offer which occasioned considerable Laughter , was not , however , accepted . Sir It . Incus spoke against the proposition . Mr . CoBDExhad no faith in any mere understanding to limit the duration of speeches . He would limit the time of speaking by a positive rule , in _ordei'tos . ivethetimcofthe * Honse , and its reputation with the country . Mr . Xewdegate remarked that if the House refused io rive due attention to great public questions , thev would be discussed by assemblies out of doors , and legislation become the mere record of _passing events .

      On -I division Mr . Gibson ' s motion was lost , by a majority of . 96 to 62 ; and the orders , as amended , we re asrreed to . „ , ,, _The - _Address . —Lord Harry Taxe broug ht up the report on the Address to her Majesty . On the _niotio _* . that thc report be read a second tune , The Marquis of Graxbt begged to be indulged ? - _& the attention ofthe House for a few _minutes . He l aboured under a verv strong conviction that the _¦ _Iw echofherMajestvdid not convey a fair repre-• • '' _''ta tioii of the condition ofthe country with _referf-ec io the manufacturing interests and the agricultural districts . ( Hear . ) With respect to the oniis-Sl 0 » of aU allusion whatever to the distress in the v _^ _euiii-rnl districts , he could not suppose that her _rj-utslv ' s _sovernment were altogether tenOEUlt of lu * tality ; and the depth of that distress . What

      F§§ Monday, Feb.5. Mhj---E Of Lords.—Lor...

      then , could be tlieir object in making no > _£ i _£ _^ 1 allusion to it in the speech from the throne ? _7- _** * -J Did they think that the conviction which was brewing in men s minds that the Free Trade system ha !* been a complete failure would he crushed by such an omission ? He recollected the prophecy made at the time of the passing of those Free Trade measures , that wages were to be raised , and tbat bread was to he had at half price . How had that prophecy been fulfilled ? He held in his hand a statement of the condition of the agricultural classes in the neig hbourhood of the country where he lived ; and as ° it was very short perhaps the House would allow hira to read to them the difference in their condition now , and what it was before the Free Trade

      measures passed . The wages in Leicestershire and Lincolnshire were now reduced from 12 s . to 10 s . He took a family to consist of five individualshusband , wife , and three children—and he presumed that they consumed half a stone of coarse flour per week . The price of flour , when the wages were 12 s was 2 s . 2 d . per stone , making for these five individuals 5 s . od . He presumed that a labourin _** - man would consume three pounds of meat a week at 6 ld . That would be ls . 71 d . a -week . The total expenses , therefore , of the flour and meat would be Ts . Oid . He now took the prices at the present moment , the wages being 10 s .: The two-and-a-half

      stone of flour now at ls . 10 d f"would be is . 7 d . ; and the meat at old . would be 4 s . iii ., the total being 5 s . Hid . The reduction , therefore , in the price would be ls . Id ., but the reduction in the mans wages was 2 s . ; so that he was worse off now than he was before by lid ( Hear , hear . ) The truth was , what was required to meet the evil of the present day was employment ; but all the legislative measures of late years had tended to reduce employment at home , and to transfer that employment to the foreigner . How could the farmer be expected , with wheat at 45 s . per quarter , to lay out capital upon Ids land , particularly now when competition was staring him in the face .

      Mr . Baxkes exposed the unfavourable indications Ofthe revenue , at which the House was perversely called upon to express its satisfaction . Mr . M . Gibson retorted upon the country gentlemen , who , he contended , were taking an extraordinary course with reference to their tenant occupiers . They did not ask for protection , and they censured the government for proposing retrenchment and economy . How coula they then hold themselves up as friends of the tenant occupiers , who would be relieved by retrenchment and a reduction of taxation ? Sir J . TTBRELLCOntcndedthatin noticingthe omissions of the Royal Speech hon . gentlemen were _doinir only what the noble lords opposite had done

      when they used to tear Royal Speeches to pieces . Seeing the indecent haste with which the government had adopted the financial scheme of the hon . member for the West Riding , it might be imagined that they were actuated by a desire to vamp up his character as a prophet . If ministers adopted the hon . member ' s plan , the least they could do was to give him a place on the Treasury bench . The government mi ht depend upon it that the agriculturists would not be destroyed without an effort being made in their behalf . Meetings on an extensive scale were about to take place in the agricultural districts , and the cause ofthe landed interest

      had lately obtained the aid of some noble converts in another place . Was it fair that agriculture should be exposed to competition with the whole world when at the present moment several articles of manufacture were protected by a duty of 10 per cent ? [ A member on the Ministerial side . — " Not cotton articles . " ] He did not allude to cotton ; some persons had _riothins * hut cotton in their heads , ( A laugh . ) ne had felt it his duty to support ministers in their estimates last session , but in consequence of their conduct upon that point he would support them no longer , and would regard the proceedings of his rig ht hon . friend the Chancellor of the Exchequer with great caution .

      Mr . Wodehouse , Mr . Frewex , and Mr . P . Bexnet , in succession , drew a lamentable picture ofthe disastrous effects ofthe policy ofthe late and present Ministers upon the agriculture of the country . Mr . Hume complained that the speech from the Throne was engrossed with foreign affairs , to the exclusion of domestic topics , as if we were the police officers of the world . He then touched upon the various grievances of the United Kingdom and the colonies , which he ascribed mainly tothe limited basis of the representation in this " country , and

      concluded by moving certain amendments with reference to the rebellions in Ceylon and the Caie of Good Hope , and the discontent in British Guiana , the Mauritius , and other British colonies , to the excessive amount of taxation , and to the state of the representation . } The amendments were seconded by Mr . Baxkes , and supported by Mr . S . Crawford , but were negatived , after an a ttempt on the -part of Mi * . Crawford to divide the House , Mr . Hume declining to do so . The address was then agreed to .

      The Irish Poor Law . —Sir W . Somerville then rose to move for the appointment of a select committee to inquire into the operation of the Irish Poor Law . Such a committee had been moved for last year , by Colonel Dunne , and the government had been unmeritedly blamed for resisting that motion ; for at the time when it was made , the law had not been fairly tested . But it was far different now . Tbey had had a year ' s trial of the Act , and he now came forward to ask for a committee to inquire into its operation . The government was blamed by the Opposition for not at once bringing

      forward a measure for the alteration of that law . But , had it done so , it would have been blamed on all hands for not compl ying with the pledge which it made last year , to grant a committee . Inquiry by a committee had now , in his opinion , become necessary . He could assure the House that the government ' did not ask for this committee for the purpose of delay . No time should be lost , after its deliberations were completed , in bringing forward such measures as the exigencies of the case might appear to warrant . He concluded his brief statement hv moving for a committee .

      Mr . French characterised the law as universally detested in Ireland . Mr . Facax observed that but for the famine which had desolated Ireland for the past three years , the rate in Ireland would not have exceeded 5 d . in the pound . It did not now , taking Ireland generally , exceed 2 s . Gd . or 2 s . 9 d . in the pound . The agitation now going on against the law in Ireland was more attributable to ~ the pressure of the rates than to any serious defect in the law itself . It was a law just in principle , and calculated to be beneficial in its operation—although the famine had rendered the rates for the present oppressive . If the law was not satisfactory to all parties , lhe fault was more in the circumstances ofthe times thin in the law itself .

      Major Blackall approved of thc course now taken by ihe Irish Secretary . But he would impress tliis upon the House , that , in framing a poor-Law for Ireland it should not take Ireland as at present circumstanced , as the basis of its action . Mr . Bright also approved of the appointment of a committee , treating poverty as the curse of Ireland . Let them adjust the poor-law as they would between district and district , it would never suffice to relieve the Irish people , so long as one moiety of them subsisted upon the other . It would not do simply to relieve , they must also diminish thc poverty of Ireland , ere they could effect any real good to that country , ' ¦ ' his thev could only do by dealing

      with the land question in Ireland as they should do . In dealing with it , they should make the poor-law a stimulus to the better cultivation of the soil . Mr . Stafford concurred in every word that had fallen from the honourable member for Manchester . Instead of relieving , a poor-law would only augment the poverty of Ireland , unless it were so framed that in its working it would stimulate to the better employment of the land . _Mt / Sadleib , Sir G . Gket , Mr . Herbert , Sir L . _O'Bries , Mr . _Moxsell , Mr . _Giulttax , Mr . S . Crawford , Mr . St . George , Mr . P . _ScnorE , and Col . Duxxe , participated in the debate , which ended in the appointment ofthe committee , andthe House adjourned at half-past twelve .

      TUESDAY , Feb . 6 . HOUSE OF LORDS . —Tlus House sat for a short time and disposed ofsome formal business . Lord Campbell laid upon the table a Bill for the Amendment of the Law of Marriage in Scotland ; and a Bill to Amend the Laws for the Registration of Births , Deaths , and Marriages in Scotland . Both bills were read a first time . On the motion of the Lord Chaxcelloh , the present system of engrossing public bills was referred to a select committee .

      HOUSE OF _COMMONS . —Lord J . _Rt-ssell gave notice that he would on Monday the 19 th inst ., move for leave to bring in a bill to alter the form of the oath to be taken by members of Parliament ( in other words , a bill for the removal of Jewish _disabilities ) . The noble lord then , in reply to a question put by the Earl of Lincoln , observed that there would be no objection to laying upon the table of the House , on an early day , copies of the paners connected with the gr ant of Vancouver ' s Islana to the Hudson ' s Bay Company . t . Mr . Horsxiax put a scries of inquiries relative to church reform , and Lord John having had since Friday to reflect , announced that in the course of the session he would introduce a bill altering the constitution ofthe Ecclesiastical Commission , and providing for a severance of the episcopal and common funds . On the subject of cathedral establishments he intimated that he did not intend to legislate .

      Lord _Palmerstox stated , in reply to Mr . Bright , that there had been recent alterations in the tariffs of Brazil , but that they would not take effect until the 1 st of Jan ., 1 SS 0 , and that they had not been made in consequence of any measures of

      ours . Scspexsiox of the Habeas Corpus Ac t ix Ire-LAXP . —Sir G . Gret then rose to move for leave to hrin _^ in a bill to continue for a further limited timo ,

      F§§ Monday, Feb.5. Mhj---E Of Lords.—Lor...

      tae aet _passed last _vi-iv f . w + i . _n M _actional period ] 1 C ; was about to _pi-opo _^ should not he required , at the hands of Parliament unless a dear , ? ase of necessity for them were made ' out . They were , m their nature and operation , exceptions to tho _constitution , and could only be justified when necessary to preserve the public tranquillity , and maintain the constitution _, lhe act passed last July had been most instrumental in preservin-- the one and maintaining the other . That act would expire on ihe lst of March , and the government now felt it incumbent

      upon it to ask for its continuance . The rig ht hon . gentleman then proceeded to state thc grounds on which he proposed to continue it . Tne circumstances in which Ireland was placed last July , fully justified the enactment of the measure in question , nor had the anticipations formed of its result been disappointed . But the circumstances under which he proposed its continuance were widely- different from those under which Lord John Russell had proposed its enactment . There were no parties now in arms against the Crown in Ireland , but the secret organisation which stimulated to the late insurrection was still more or less in existence , whilst the spirit of disaffection was yet prevalent , particularly in the districts which were the scene of the recent

      insurrectionary attempt . To show that it was no " mock insurrection , " as some hon . members had asserted it to be , and , at the same time , to demonstrate the extent to which organisation and disaffection still prevailed , the right hon . gentleman quoted several documents , amongst which was the letter of a Mr . M'Ghee , which had been copied some time ago by the press of this country from one of the _^ ew York journals . Looking , then , at this organisation , which was only in abeyance , if not in actual operation , and atthe spirit of disaffection , which in some districts of the country , scarcely courted concealment , the government felt bound , in order to prevent a recurrence of the insane insurrectionary

      movement of List year , and to restore , as far as possible , confidence and security to the well-affected in Ireland , to demand of Parliament the continuance , for a further limited time , of the extraordinary powers recently intrusted to the Lord-Lieutenant . The spirit in whieh Lord Clarendon had alreadv exercised the powers confided to him was a guarantee that their operation , if continued , would be strictly limited to the necessities of the case . He then read the greater part of the Lord-Lieutenant ' s letter , to show that it was his Excellency ' s opinion , founded upon the most ample information , that the continuance of the powers in question was absolutely indispensable to themaintenance of tranquillity in

      Ireland . As to the time for which their continuance was sought , it was the anxious desire ofthe government to limit it to the shortest possible period . He would , therefore , propose that the act passed last-July should be continued for a further period of six months , and concluded by moving for leave to bring in a bill to that effect . Mr Joux O'Coxxell moved , as an amendment , that a committee , consisting of twenty-one members , be formed by ballot , to examine such documents as might be laid before it ; and to report to the Houso its opinion upon those documents , whether the continuance of tne suspension of the Habeas Corpus Act be a measure necessary to thc tranquillity of

      Ireland at the present time . The proposal of the continuance of the act was solel y based upon the Lord-Lieutenant ' s letter , which , in his opinion , gave anything but a fair picture of the exact state of things in Ireland . The real object of the bill was not to prevent the recurrence of insurrection , but to strike down constitutional agitation in that country . In other words it was a blow at the constitution , not only in Ireland , but also in this country , and honourable members might live to regret the sanction which they were about to give it . He opposed the measure , first , because it was one of coercion ; and next , because the plea of necessity had not been made out .

      Mr . Feargus O'Coxxor said he did not feel much astonished at the right hon . gentleman the Secretary of State forthe Home Department making such a proposition to the House , when he saw so much difficulty on the part ofthe hon . member for Limerick in finding a seconder for his resolution . He ( Mr . F . O'Connor ) had listened with great attention both to the right hon . gentleman and to the hon . member , and he should say that the right hon . the _Secretary of State brought forcibly to his recollection the story ofthe lawyer , who said he would much prefer to have a good subservient jury to the best case that ever went before a court . The ri ght

      hon . gentleman had altogether abandoned his case , and relied entirely upon the subserviency of the House to destroy the last remnant of Irish liberty , but beforo he animadverted upon the case of the rig ht hon . gentleman—if ease it could be called—duty compelled him to repudiate tho odium sought to be cast upon Mr . M'Ghee and others , who were insultingly called refugees , but who were really banished men—banished by the tyranny of the government , and the training and duplicity of that party to whom the hon . member for Limerick helonged . Mr . John O'Coxxell . —2 fo , no .

      Mi ' . O ' Coxxor . —I repeat it . It is easy to put party or ministerial construction upon words ; but what did thc hon . member ' s father mean when he asked for a petition from five hundred thousand fighting men , the prayer to conclude with an humble appeal to this House ? Mr . John O ' Coxxell . —No , no . . Mr . O'Coxxor . —Nothing easier to deny , but I heard it with-my own ears . ( Hear , hear . ) And did the hon . gentleman forget that in 1843 , when moral force was at a discount , that he stated to his hearers , in Conciliation Hall , that , if that their last appeal to the Saxon Parliament failed , he would bo found in the front ranks ofthe Irish invading army , and would lead his countrymen to death or glory , Mr . Jons O'Coxxell . —No , no .

      Mr . O'Coxxor . —Then the Times lies and all the Irish papers lie , and that was impossible , as whoever read a lie or even a prevarication in a news _, pap er 9 ( Hear , and Liughter . ) However , he would pass from the consideration of that part of the subjeet into which he was provoked by the ungenerous assault of the hon . memher upon those who had risked their liberty in opposing ministerial tyranny . The lion , gentleman quoted a speech of Fox , but he appeared to forget that there was a difference between a minister seeking power and a minister exercising power : that when Fox made that speech he was in opposition , and relied upon professions of constitutional loyalty for

      his passport to the Ministerial benches . He would now turn to the consideration of thc speech of the right hon . Secretary for tlie Home Department—if , indeed , specch _' it could be called—and he would ask that House if it had ever fallen to their lot to hear a more vague , incoherent , weak , unsatisfactory , and inconclusive appeal ? ( Hear , hear . ) Well , yet , nevertheless , the Ensrlish gentlemen who sit upon this side of thc House " wilI give their assent to the measure because it is a blow at Irish liberty in which tbey are willing to aid the government in the hope of stabbing Ensrlish liberty . Now , what was the case of the right aon . _jrentleman . Firstly , echoing the speech of the

      noble lord , who moved the address to the Queen , he says—We admit that at present there is perfect tranquillity in Ireland : but Lord Clarendon , the Saxon Viceroy of the Irish people , in the distant horizon , sees the dim shadow of rebellion , And the Minister gravely says to the House , will you im * mgn the vision of this far-seeing oracle ? will you deny to this great statesman those powers , extraordinary and uncoh r ' stitutional as they may be , the necessity for which looms in thedistance ? tranquillity you must take as ihe womb of insurrection , therefore , I require the violation of the constitution as a means of defencennd pan vou doubt his sagacity ? says the rig ht hon .

      gentleman . That was his first proposition . His second was a most enthusiastic laudation of the constabulary of Ireland . He eulogised their loyalty , praised their bravery , and extolled their patriotism , while he appeared to forget that he was thereby weakening his charge of Irish disloyalty , and was establishing grounds for remedial instead of coercive measures . Was he not aware that this very constabulary was composed Of Catholics , and docs not his encomium prove that Catholics can be satisfied , nav , patriotic and loyal , when they are placed i situation to earn their breadno matter how

      rena , nuTiant to their feelings ? ( Hear , hear . ) The B proposition of the rig hUcm . gontleman wa _« that the Lord-Lieutenant required the measure to carr out his Irish policy , but he failed to describe that policvtothefiouse . In fact , it _^ s a complete surrender of ministerial power and responsil _lifv to i Saxon Yiceroy . No remedial measures , £ & 3 _F _^ aT- _& _fr 3 he able to show that this very system was

      the foundation of leg itimate Irish _oisanecuo .. When the Whigs reqnired agitation , who thenfos-Kdttf When ngftation , no matter how _; _notoj = + _ntenure _natronagc , then who opposed it ? TV hat _™ W _notto of " he Whig Viceroy , Lord Ang lesea ? was themotto ot tne n _fi _^ _^& S _\^ c- _*^ _™ that thc _TO 1 S

      F§§ Monday, Feb.5. Mhj---E Of Lords.—Lor...

      Ministers no longer dcpoi .: ! upon servile Irish support alone-hut when t vrann _** _, coercion , and o > - _pi-cMion-ire the . . questions , thev call HOW depend _iirwiT ?} _-t _' _* « - _* _' _?** _•»•« _iho-ri-ilit ion . baronet , the member for Tamworth . But " did n _tuS'Cse fc ? «* W- * pW 4 Ve in tins House , that thoy would stay the current of national ind . gnat . cn in Ireland f Vtat wnsTobo the policy of this _g _^ on autocrat ? -it had not beeJ defined by the right hon . gentleman . Buthe would _explamit . Itwas _t-his-tliat if any , the most heal mg or beneficial measure was proposed for Seland ±£ _\ " ± * 3 ? ti 0 n * 9 enforce it ° this

      * _T " . u on House , the supporters of that agitation would be come the victims of the Ticeroy-publie opinion would be checked- _^ national disquietude anddissatisfaction would rankle silentl y in the breasts of Irishmen until the aggregated feeling would become too powerful for the Viceroy and the Ministers . Who now will dare to agitate for legitimate purposes ? If it is not illtgal , it becomes unconstitutional , and you constitute the Saxon Viceroy the Saxon gaoler-general , and if his authority is impugned , lie says : — " Rely entirel y on me . I am the constitution

      ;—« - -i - - T '" Iam Oracle ! 'And when I ope my mouth let no dog bark . '" He told them last session that the suppression of publie opinion would lead to secret societies and associations while its free expression would enable the sound judgment of the many to curb the folly ofthe few . But , continue this power in the hands of the Lord-Lieutenant , and who then will dare to complain of famine , ejection , or tvranny ? If he does not violate the law , he violates the Viceroy s constitution—Well , but thc right hon . gentleman lias attempted to furnish evidence from documents printed in New York ; but if the opinion of the House is to be governed by the usual rules of evidence , tho right hon . gentleman destroyed his

      own case . Itis a legal maxim , that if a portion of a letter is read , its whole contents must be read , as one part may neutralise or qualify another . The right hon . gentleman , however , unguardedlv read a portion , which , from his own ministerial knowledge , he was enabled to refute , and did refute , and , therefore , that whole document must be rejected ; but then the right hon . gentleman knows that the shortest sentence , however qualified by thc whole , will be accepted by this House as a valid and substantial indictment against Ireland . Then wc have the prospectus ofa new newspaper , to appear when the tyrannical law expires . Then we have an anonymous epistle , of course , from the most loyal , cveditable , and well-disposed gentleman in Ireland

      and who will dare to impugn his veracity ? ( Hear , hear . ) I vouch for it , says the right hon . gentleman—but did the House ever hear , or did the world ever hear , ofa bad Irish landlord when his character or his evidence was necessary to sustain ministerial tyranny ? Ask any Irish gentleman in this House if he is a bad landlord , and what will be the answer : " No ; I am the best in the country . " Ask ifany tenant has been tyrannically ejected . The answer is "No _. he was thc greatest _vagabond in the country . _"Letthemlooktowiat . _waspassingaround . _Whenever terror was to be struck into England , _L-eland was made the scapegoat ; , whenever war was to he _washed with opinion m England , Ireland was to be made the battle-field . But , however weak the Irish

      party might be in this House , —however weak the Irish interest mi ght be in the si ght of the government , ho warned them that they could not go on destroying the constitution of a portion of this country , when on the Continent new constitutions were being granted every day—constitutions in harmony with the advancing spirit of tlie age . _Thei-e was one thing , however , in which he agreed with the right honourable gentleman the Home Secretary , tliat it was not to this House or to this government , but to their own landlords er resident gentry that the Irish were to look for protection . But what were the facts ? The rig ht honourable gentleman knew well that the Irish gentlemen hero would support him in any measure against the lib erties ot Ireland . Well , let them stop the _progress

      of public opinion , and what were they to expect ? Why , clubs and secret associations , and plotting and conspiracy . Were they to give to public opinion its full scope , they would find that what was right and good and sound and wholesome in that public opinion would absorb , and put down what was bad and wrong and vicious . He wished to ask this question , would government dare to behave to England as they were behaving to Ireland ? Did they forget the letter of Tom _Youjv , of the Home Oflice —( laughter )—to General Napier , asking * him to tako tho command of tho Brummagems , in case every other means of agitation were to fail ? ( Oh , oh , and laughter . ) But the noble lord sittinsr there ( pointing to the Treasury

      benches ) and sitting here ( pointing to the Opposition benches , ) is a very _diftereftt person—as different as night from day . ( Alaugh . ) As for himself , he had been taunte ' d with loyalty . ( Loud laughter . ) But he had to ask , ¦ what was the meaning of loyalty ? Was tlie loyalty of a Minister of the Crown , who went down every quarter-day to the Treasury to pocket his salary , the same sort of thing as that which was to be expected in the case of a poor alien in blood , language , and religionthe victim of grinding middlemen—oppressed by a dominant church , and tyrannised over by the unconstitutional acts of an arbitrary government ? ( Oh . ) Honourable gentlemen said " Oh . " Was not Ireland , a Catholic country , subjected to the tyranny

      of a Protestant church ? He certainly had expected this session to have heard something in the royal speech about the endowment ofthe Catholic clergy . But tlie noble lord dared not introduce it . The time , however , when a reform in this respect must take place , was possibly not so far off . What Catholicism was in Ireland , the religion of the Jews was in Berlin ' and the house knew what had recently happened m Prussia . When tlie Berlin insurrection broke out , the English press charged the Jewish proprietors of newspapers in that city with being tlie _ramentors of rebellion , and marvelled at the fact as the disabilities under whicn _thi-y previously suffered had been all removed . J 3 ufc is this House not aware that those vory disabilities engendered that

      morbid feeling , that rankling hatred against the system which imposed them , and that those feelings were naturally transmitted from generation to generation , from sire to son ? Though the disabilities may be nominally removed , the dominant ascendency conferred upon the oppressor still remained in force , and so itwas in Ireland . You talk of emancipation , you talk of equality , but still the badge of inferiority exists , and a people nine-tenths Catholics , are still suffering under the statutory enactments of tlie dominant fiction . ( Hear . ) lie regretted the absence ofthe rig ht hon . baronet the member for Tamworth , who formerly twitted him with his want of loyalty , nnd if he hadbeen present he would have asked that right hon . baronet what

      identity of loyalty existed between the pampered squire , possessing lands by the title of conquest , and that of the alien in language , religion , and blood , mado tributary to a dominant State Church ? Where would he find the loyalty of him who paid willing dues to his own priests and forced contributions to the alien—the man who was transferred from the lord in fee to thc middleman , and handed over , if charged with criminality , to a jury of Protestants ? ( Hear , hear . ) What was tlie ease of Ireland ? The owner of the soil let to a middleman , he abandoned his duties ; the middleman became his substitute on the magisterial bench , and in the grand jury room , and to justify his own tyranny ho maligns thc character of his injured serf . Therefore it was the injustice

      ofthe Saxon law tliat constituted tho minister ' s greatest difficulty—a diffioulty which he would vainly hope to allay by repeated acts of coercion . This rankled in the Irish mind , and to prove Irish hatred of Saxon law , he would instance Irish feeling thus : Suppose a Protestant parson to be hated and despised in his parish , yet so inveterate is the _Irishman ' s hatred of Saxon laws , that every man would join that unpopular parson in resisting law . ( Hear , ' hear . ) It was ridiculous to talk of the law ' s justieo , and the law ' s impartiality . He ( Mr . O'Connor ) was once professionally employed forthe crown , but not by the crown , in the case of General Sir George Bingham ; the crown refused to prosecute and he did prosecute . He struck off from the jury

      panel thc inveterate Orangemen , and Mv Justice " _$ ie 6 re , in a rage , declared that he had never seen fo -unconstitutional a use made of the prerogative of the crown , but mark the difference when Young Irelanders are to be tried . The defendant sat on the bench with the judge . He was found guilty . The judge turned to him when tlie verdict was pronounced , shook hands with him , fined him sixpence , aud the judge and thc criminal left thc court in the same carriage . Hon . gentlemen laugh at suchahact of partiality and injustice , when the criminal is to their taste , but tlieir loyalty prompts them to revile such an act when an Irishman is the subject . He warned them that , however thoy might seek to tranquillise Ireland , they would never succeed until

      they had dislodged the ascendency of that church , which now , as the conquering church , domineered over the people . Thc House had heard of the necessity ot preserving the dignity and authority of the law in Ireland . But how had they shown their strength , and he would add , their impartiality , upon a recent occasion ? Why , when two Americans had been incarcerated , they were at once set at liberty , upon the demand of the American minister . Thus , while Irishmen were imprisoned , Americans were allowed to escape . Such had been the weak and vacillating policy of government : and it was after

      such displays that they expected loyalty _lnastai'vin " people . Does the House recollect the inducement held out by Mr . Canning for transferring the government of Ireland to England ? He said : "Wo all admit that you have grievances that should be remedied , while it is impossible to apply those remedies in the midst of Irish agitation , therefore remove discussion from those troubled scenes to that calm and quiet arena where public opinion will have its infiuencc , and legislation will be guided by the sound judgment of this House ; and this was the manner in which the present government proposed to redeem the pledge of that

      F§§ Monday, Feb.5. Mhj---E Of Lords.—Lor...

      minister . He coiitenued that tlie conduct of ] _- " n _..-l ; uiil towards Ireland * was as bad us hail ever been ' _tlT-i ' t of Russia to Poland . Had they ever heard of a million of . 'Poles dying of famine ? Tlie time was come _, however , when Ministers must refiuct upon these things . How did it happen that , with the most fertile soil , thc most genial climate , and the most industrious population in the world , there existed in Ireland more misery—more want—more famine , than on any other spot of the whole earth . ( Oh I ) lie saw lion , members sneering—ho heard them murmuring and muttering—what did he care for that ? Not one farthing . ( Alaugh . ) No—he looked to publie opinion . He saw thorn now attempting to resist thc financial reformers . But what were they

      doing in all other countries—what were they doing in Republican France ? And here let them riot be mistaken , he never was a Republican — he never would be a Republican—that was , unless he very much altered his mind . ( Shouts of laughter . ) But what must be the popular opinion of that form of government , judging of it by thc efforts which were seen to flow trom it in other countries ? Tho people wished for a reduction in the army and navy . They were told that they could not have it because England wasa monarch y , ( Oh , oh . ) Yes , could thev hold up their monarchy and point to it as _effectinsr tim

      same reforms nnd reductions which were _takinsr place under the Republic in France , both in the army and navy of tliat kingdom ? Would they be able much longer to stand against such pressure from without ? The gentlemen of the " standstills , the gentlemen of the " _wait-awhiles , " and the gentlemen of the " go-aheads "—( Iaughter ) - seemod all to be absent . Nevertheless , ho would tell them , that their recent Free Trade legislation would be tlie ruin of Ireland . Thc right hon . baronet the member for Ripon laughed . Sir Jamks GliiiUM . —No , no I differ from you in opinion only .

      Mr . Feargus O'Coxxor was glad , at all events , to see tlie right honourable baronet in his place . lie snpposed that he had been left on duty by his party as a sort of sentinel until they came back again . ( A laugh . ) lie would toll him and the House , however , that he ( Mr . F . O'Connor ) would much prefer the Free Trade measures , and measures of concession of the late colleague of the ri ght honourable gentleman , to tho Free Trade measures and concessions —which were merely bidding for power—of the noble lord opposite . ( Hear . ) As for Ireland , sho wanted no relief—she only wanted justice . They dealt with any description of property , save that which belonged to a landlord . So much for Ministers in oflice . What had been the policy of Ministers when out of office ? They had first encouraged , nay , created , revolution in this country , and they now blamed tlieir followers in Ireland .

      " Cum duces faciunt talia , quid non militesfacient ?" He believed that any difficulty of which the Irish had to complain was traceable to the conduct of their landlords . The old system was to feed the landlords by patronage—to cultivate their estates bv patronage . Now the noble lord was afraid of thein . Why , let them go home ; he was not a man much attended to by tlie House—his opinions were no : very popular , but the House would remember that lie had proposed Poor-laws for Ireland in 1834 , with a tax upon absentees , with labour premiums , farm premiums , and other similar inducements to improved cultivation . He held that the House must compel Irish landlords to give leases in perpetuity , then they would not have crowds emigrating every

      day , and taking with them a great deal of the disposable capital ofthe country . What would be the effect of tenure in perpetuity ? A letter had been published tlie other day from Mr . Charles _Conlthurst , who managed tho estates of Sir Nicholas Coulthurst , in Kerry . This letter related to circumstances as far back as 1818 . There was then a large farm upon the estate , from which not more than £ 600 a year could be realised . Mr . Coulthurst undertook to get £ 1 , 000 per annum for it , if he were allowed to let it in small portions and in perpetuity . What was the result ? Why they cleared annually £ 1 , 330 from tho land in question , while there was not a man connected with the locality now who was disaffected to government

      to use Ins own words , an old woman would collect the rent ; the presence of an agent was never required for thirty years ; the tenants paid their rent by letters of credit , * they took their money out of the old stockings , expended it upon reproductive labour * the estate , he says , would sell like a debenture in the market , £ 100 , 000 being expended upon it in building improvements , and over £ 40 , 000 in reclamation , Then ho gives you another instance ofthe value of leases in perpetuity s he says , that in the parish of Coachford , you can pitch a stone from little domain to little domain , ' that there the poor rates are 2 Jd . in the pound , while in a neighbouring parish thoy are 7 s . 6 d . Well , then , will this not convince you that every grievance of the

      complaining landlords is thc consequences of their own neglect of duty , and , instead of passing laws to enable them to grind the faces of their unfortunate tenants and labourers , pass a law to compel them to cultivate their land upon the reproductive system , and then Ireland would be tranquil , and the " Chancellor ofthe Exchequer will not be obliged to come to you for supplies to relieve Irish distress , consequent upon landlords' neglect of duty ? ( Hear , hear . ) Ifc was sorry the noble lord , the Secretary for Foreign Affairs , was not in his place , as he should have complimented the noble lord upon the soundness of his domestic and pacific policy , as ho had turned his sword into a ploughshare , or rather into a spade , as he was upon the _dhrgin- * system

      and tlie result of wliich was , that he had nearly doubled the value of an estate in less than two years . ( Hear , hear , ) Well , why did not they compel all Irish landlords to do the same ? Why so fastidious with what was called the vested rights of landlords , thc unjust use of which caused millions to starve ? Again , see what Mr . Hamilton , a most experienced practical and large agriculturist says , of thedifference between a mere casual holding and perpetuity of tenure : —He says , a farm which would now let badly for £ 15 a year , would fetch £ 20 upon a lease in perpetuity , and would be worth £ 50 in ten years . Well , these are the lazy Irish , the Irish who were invited—nay , compelled—to emigrate ; and then , when they accepted thc invitation , the Times , the

      mouthpiece of the party who wanted ' o depopulate thc country , turns round in horror andin sorrow , and asks—What is to become of us if we lose the hard-working laborious Irish ? Who will pave our streets , who will carry the hod to the coping stone 1 Who will be our wharfingers , our coal-heavers and scavengers , if wc lose our laborious Irish labourers . Sir , this subject may be uninteresting to the right hon . tlie Secretary for tlie Home Department , but he has proved that he wants Instruction upon It , and it is positively indecent for him to remain in conversation with the whipper-in , exhibiting levity and disregard , while I am giving him the information he requires . ( Hear , hear . ) He ( Mr . O'Connor ) regretted the absence of thc hon .

      and gallant member for Middlesex , who taunted him last session with making constant reference to his prophecies—but , unscarod , ho would refer tho House to another of his predictions . He told the House that America , excited by tlie strong feeling and angry passions of expatriated Irishmen , would look with an anxious eye to the emancipation of their country . Let them beware of its realisation . In Canada thoy wore tottering , and because at too great a distance to receive domestic armaments to put down colonial inquietude , the Governor-General was _oblisred to proclaim a general amnesty to all political offenders , and to apply the royal domains to colonial education . Was not that a system of terror ? and did the noble lord hope to rock his

      little cradle , with his mangled Constitution , inthe midst of surrounding convulsion and revolution , whore Constitutions were being framed upon thc basis of progressive knowledge , instead of upon the caprice of ministerial necessity . ( Hear , hear . ) Let them look to Prussia , the great Protestant kingdom of Europe ; let thorn read the address of Mr Harkort , the chairman of thc Berlin Conservative Election Club , and there they would find the foreshadowing of Protestant England ' s Constitution ; he says , " See what tlie king has done for you , he proposes to allow the flock to elect their own shepherd , to make education national and imperative , to divide the royal domains into peasant allotments ; he tells you that the monies spent in excitement

      would have located 6 , 500 hard working men upon their peasant allotments ; and he tells you that parsons , jobbers , and lawyers , looking for places , livings , and presidentships , wero occupied in taking care of themselves , and had no time to take care of the people . " This was a truism , and he ( Mr . O' Connor ) for one , wished that there was not a lawyer or placehunter in that Houso . Were they , in the face of facts like these , then , to be told that government could not interfere in such matters ? Were government not to make regulations between landlord and tenant , when on those regulations depended the tranquillity and prosperity ofthe country ? But it was hopeless to iook to the present government . They were powerful in opposition—they were powerless in office ; and he hoped to see them soon again in the situation which they were destined

      by nature to fill . ( A laugh . ) Then they would be men who would stand up for economy — men who would drive thc right hon . baronet , the member for Tamworth , from office were he to propose another Arms Bill . Such would be the policy of the noble lord in opposition ; but how long would it last after he had crossed to the Ministerial benches ? ( Hear , hear . ) Thero had been an allusion made by the noble lord who moved the address to the Chartists . Tiicy were told that the Chartists had been put down last April . Now they had neither been put down then , nor were they put down yet . Oh , oh . ) Lord Joux Russell pointed to the clock . Mr . O'Coxxor continued : Sir , the noble lord has directed my attention to the time-table : perhaps I have exceeded my hour , but I was the person last session who suggested the limitation of speeches to that period ; last night I voted for it , and he voted against it , therefore I hope in turn he will be critical

      F§§ Monday, Feb.5. Mhj---E Of Lords.—Lor...

      its oi . servaiice . ( L _,-Mi-- ! ife ! _-. ' H- bad lin ; , » ! l !( ¦ _- ,-U > say . Wi _- . _iil-i u > l : „ , \ th . it lie had it iii his _j . ower to stop tho progro * of the bill before thein ' . What could he _mn-e intolerable , more unjust , _iiinl more ui _' _coiwtuutumiil than thfU the Iloine _Secivtarv should come down to the House and tell them that ? , Jn f t , ' a i , qUl 1 , h _? - that nevertheless , he enteraui that , in-consequence of those _-. _nticip-itio _,. _-, he asked for an extenued limit to the arbitrary powers now m force ! What ! w as Ireland _ahvavs to be governed by ministerial anticipations , tet them beware , however , of this fresh attempt to p „ down public opinion m Ireland . Thev had lately lnd many examples that what was called criminality one ht be accounted

      day mig patriotism the next , lie would conclude by reminding them that the day would yet come when tho criminal should stand iii the awful presence of that Great Judge , into whose councils neither the dictum ofthe cabinet , the partiality of the judge , the quibble of thc official , nor the prejudice of the jury , would dare to enter ; where crime would bo such , but not by construction of human law , political ingenuity , " or fanatical hypocrisy . ( Hear , hear . ) Mr . E . " B . Roche , in offering his opposition to the bill , also maintained that no case had been made out for its re-enactment . It appeared from Mr . M'Ghce ' s letter , which had been relied upon by the Home Secretary , that Ireland would have been

      revolutionised last year , but for the interposition ofthe Roman Catholic priests . The priests were now as loyal as they were then , and quite as capableas before of rescuing Ireland from revolution . Of what , then , was the government afraid , seeing that they had such influential guardians of the peace in Ireland ? The motion ofthe ri ght honourable gentleman was founded , not upon a proved necessity , but upon a flimsy pretext . Ifthe government were in earnest , it might regenerate Ireland without taking a penny irom the people of En land . Thev might greatly economise m _conductintr the government of Ireland , and apply the savings t . ierebv effected to the soci-l and material improvement of the people . But coercion , and not relief , had ever been the fate of Ireland _; and such , it appeared , it was still to be .

      Mr . Facax felt it to be his duty to srive thc measure his strenuous and continuous opposition . Ireland could not be ruled by insurrectionary acts and measures for the suspension of tlie Habeas Corpus Act . Admitting that last year there mi g ht have been a semblance of a reason for suspending that act , there was certainly none now . The object of the government was to suppress thc expression of public opinion in Ireland , and to crush an agitatiofi which had solely for its object the repeal of an act of Parliament . Instead of striking at tbe root of thc evil , Ministers confined their attempts at cure to the symptoms of the disease . lie did not wish to pursue a factious course , but would join his fellowmembers in any opposition , within the forms of the House , which they might consider it advisable to offer to the bill .

      Mr . Grattax said that the suspension of thc Habeas Corpus Act was a hazardous experiment ; it had often been tried and as often failed . There was nothing in the character of the people of Ireland to disqualify them for the enjoyment of liberty , — " The fault , dear Brutus , is not in our stars , But in ourselves , that we are underlings . " In former cases how did the people of England act ? Did they ever suspend thc libei ties of their country upon sueh a short notice , or without proof ? Did not Mr . Pitt and Lord _Castlereagh eome down to the House with large bags filled with letters and sworn informations before the Habeas Corpus Act was suspended ? In 1790 Mr . Pitt appointed a committee on the subieefc- in tho followinw vear

      therewas one in Ireland , and documents were laid on the table to show the necessity of the act being suspended . All that was wanting here . The government followed advice that was not serviceabl- — they followed advice that was anti-Irish ; ami so long as they excluded from tlieir councils men who knew something of Ireland , it would be impossible to manage the affairs of that country . Thev themselves had not time for it , and the consequence was that their measure- " were adopted in haste . There was hesitation at thc outset , and precipitation at the end . He contended that this measure was unnecessary . The Irish had no idea of calling in a French or an American army—they were silent and quiet . The Lord-Lieutenant had samiuity

      cnough to distinguish between quietude and affection ; but not between force and affection . He liad heard it said that England must be feared before she could be loved . That was the motto now , and thia measure was the illustration ; hut lie would say , let her be loved before she was feared . He maintained that Ireland did not deserve this measure . The house was in laughter on the previous evening- when they spoke of insurrection in Ireland . There had boon none . It existed onlv in tho minds of interested individuals , who could get up an insurrection at any time . If they would pay him for it , he would get one up in forty-eight hours . ( Laughter . ) He reniembored hearing- when he was a boy the ory of " permanent pay "—that was tho

      cry of thc Orangemen—and it meant that there was to be a Catholic rebellion got up , so that the corps would be increased and there should be permanent pay . He suspected _something of the same kind at this time . Thc government had made it the interest of men to do mischief ; and it was a horrid —a hellish system . He knew from men in Dublin Castle that it liad been done , not merely bv tho Whig party but by the Tories , though he was ' told that they never carried it to such an extent as his Whig Mends , Let them not manufacture spies . Let Ireland be governed by greater talent , and not by a second-class set of Ministers dressed up from

      some old clothes-shop . ( Laughter . ) The Lord-Lieutenant said that the people of Ireland showed nothing of a _rejiontant spirit . They had done nothing fo repent of ; for , could it be said that the people of Ireland , the gentry , thc Roman Catholio clergy , had joined in the insurrection , as it was called ? Why , there was no such insurrection , no overt act was proved ; and the lawyers were obliged to bring in a number of letters , written some time before , to make out their case . O'Brien distinctly denied all participation with the party who were for violent proceedings ; ho separated from them , and , in liis conversations , expressed opinions very different from those whom he was _charsred with

      intending to excite to insurrection . He had heard 0 'linen charged , in that House , with having gone to Fran * - } to solicit French aid , but M . Lamartine had indignantly denied it . Did the Lord-Lieutenant mean to say that agitation was to cease—that there was to be no discussion of measures which thoy considered wrong and wished by legal and constitutional means to repeal ? All history proved that that should not be done , and ho believed that if it were the disease would be aggravated . They might put down repeal , hut they would set up separation . What charm was there to Ireland in the connexion with this country ? Why should lie , as an Irishman , like tho English better than the French ? The French were as well mannered—ns agreeable . [ An Hon .

      Memi ! i : n . — " And as good looking . " ] He did not think so . ( A laugh . ) He liked the honest face of an Englishman better than those mustachioed fellows , begging the hon . gentleman ' s pardon . [ Thc hoi :, member , as he said this , slightly bowed to Mr . Muntz , who was sitting near him , and a hearty laugh rang through the house . ] It happened that on tliat day there was to he tried in Ireland an individual who had been in g aol seven months . The Attorney-General of Ireland was an able man , he knew , but with his unbaptised spaniels he was unable to obtain convictions . How was it that he could not instruct them to succeed ? Ifc was obliged to get packed juries to convict . Oh ! if the Attoriiev-Goneral were there he could make the

      blood fly from his heart , and the light from his ' countenance . ( L aughter . ) Of 177 jurors impanelled to try one of tlie political prisoners ( Mr . Duffy , as we understood ) , 135 were Protestants and only 43 Catholics , four of whom were tradesmen hi the employ of the Lovd-Licutonnnt and public contractors . How could Irishmen be in love with law so administered' ? He entreated English members to stay away from the division to-night , and save at thc same time the liberties of Ireland and their own reputation . Would they repeat in Ireland the scenes that occurred in Lord Castleveag h ' _s time , when men were incarcerated without any proof whatever of their guilt ? lie declared that

      he would rather that martial law should be proclaimed in Ireland than that Parliament should _ go on this way , suspending the constitutional privileges of his countrymen . He felt that he could move those who now heard him to tears if he wen * to relate what lie had seen in the course ofa recent tour which he had made through a portion of Ireland , —if he were to describe the ruinous devastation , tlie houses destroyed , the landlords ruined , and the tenants flying —( hear)—and now they were going to add a climax to the sufferings and degradation of his unhappy country . Irishmen know how to die as well as Englishmen ; Englishmen knew how to die on the field of glory , but let not Irishmen die in a ditch with dishonour . ( Cheers . )

      Mr . CiilSHOLM Axstky could not concur cither in the motion submitted hy Sir Geo . Grey , or in the amendment proposed by Mr . J . O'Connell . Admitting the correctness of nearly all the statements contained in the letter of the Lord-Lieutenant , the case made out in that document was utterly insufficient to justify such a measure as that proposed . He would , therefore , not vote for it , nor would he vote for the amendment , as he considered that thc inquiry which it contemplated would be fruitless . In committee , however , should the bill ever reach

      thaistage , he would propose some alterations , whieh , if adopted , would tend to mitigate its severity . The last member gave some account of Mr . M'Ghee . He described him as an enthusiastic young man , who , up to thc 25 th of last February , when thc news arrived from Paris , had been engaged in _restraining the ardour of his younger fellow-countrymen , and had beon , as he had shown bv his _writings and declarations , a high Torv . What he had done since had been done under the effect of excitement . "The man was a poet—a

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      good 1 _*^^^^ * _nm - _^ illifsJtf XT . _~ - »* 4 » _v" _* _v _-y _** v _* 5 ?

  • Citation
    • Northern Star (1837-1852), Feb. 10, 1849, page 7, in the Nineteenth-Century Serials Edition (2008; 2018) ncse-os.kdl.kcl.ac.uk/periodicals/ns/issues/ns3_10021849/page/7/