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Leader (1850-1860), 7th July 1860, Edition 1 of 2, Page 642

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    • STATE DOCUMENTS.
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      subjects in the Ionian Islands , which was read a third time . In the House of Commons , the House went into Committee on the Mines [ Regulations and Inspection Bill . Mr- Ayr-ton proposed a clause to abolish the " truck " and " butty " system in paying-, miners , winch was agreed-to , and-the . Bill was ordered to be reported to the House . In the House of Commons on Wednesday , on the order for the second reading- of the Church-rates Law Amendment Bill , Mr . Hubbakd moved that the order be discharged , pledging himself , if the Government , or some other member did not take up the subject , he observations

      would do so next session . The motion , after some by Mr . Griffith , was agreed to , and the Bill was withdrawn . Sir G . Lewis's Highway Bill was read a second time . Mr . Srooxisu consented to withdraw the Dealers in Marine Stores Bill , on the traders-landing that the subject would be inquired into by the Government . The Metropolitan Building Act ( 1855 ) Amendment Bill passed the committee . Other Bills were forwarded a stage without debate , leave was given to bring in certain Bills , and the House adjourned at 5 minutes to 6 o ' clock .

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      IN compliance with our former announcement , and our original design in the new form of this Paper , of giving nationally important State Documents , in order that they may be conveniently preserved and referred to , we give the following , as certainly coming within the class of documents to be so preserved : —

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      REPORT ON THE PRIVILEGES OF THE HOUSE OF COMMONS . The following Report was presented to the House of Commons on Friday , the 29 th of June , 1860 : — - The Select Committee appointed to search the journals of both Houses of Parliament , in order to ascertain and report on the practice of each House with regard to the several descriptions of Bills jmuosing or repealing taxes , have searched the . said journals accordingly , and have agreed to tie following Report : —' - . I , Your committee have searched for precedents in the journals , from the year 1628 to the present time , in order that they might

      ascertain and report on the practice pursued by eitlier House with regard to the several descriptions of Bills imposing and repealing taxes . The practice and the mode of procedure is somewhat different , according-to the character and object of those Bills . ^_ Your committee have , therefore ^ for the sake of clearness , classified the same , chiefly under one cir the other of the following heads : — . 1 . Bills of Supply and Tax Bills j 2 , Bills for appropriating Supplies ; . 3 . Public Bills , which are riot strictly Bills of Supply or Tax Bills , but which operate as a tax or charge on the people > and

      4 . Bills for altering or repealing Acts which relate to Supply , Taxes , or Charges . . V Your committee have thought it . necessary to call the attention of the House to those crises only in which the Lords have interfered . ~^ -lTr ^ ottr-committee- <^ m nWn « Gd ^ for two reasons—first , because the previous . cases arc-most ably commented on in the great precedent of 1671 ; nnd , seeond ] y , because the year 1628 is the year in which the present form of granting the supplies may be said to have been ' practically established . BiiT-s of Supply and Tax Bills . The Commons grant : the Lords assent .

      suffice than a tenth and a half from the cities and . boroughs , and a fifteenth and a half from the other lay people ; and , besides , to grant a prolongation of the subsidy of wools , hides , and wooltells , and of 3 s . of tonnage and 12 d . of poundage , from the nest approaching feasfc of St . Michael till the feast of St . Michael two years next ensuing . On which , by command of the King , a message > vas sent to the ' Commons of this present Parliament that they should cause , to come before the King and the -said Lords a certain number ot persons Of their body to hear and report to their companions what they should have in command from our Lord the King aforesaid . And on this , the said Commons sent to the presence ot the King and the said Lords twelve of their companions , to whom , by command of the Kingthe aforesaid question was declared , together

      , with the answer of the said Lords severally given to the same . Which reply it was the will of the King that they should report to the remainder of their companions ; so that they should take steps to conform to the answer of the Lords . Which report being made to the said Commons , they were greatly disturbed , saying and affirming that it was in great prejudice and derogation oi their liberties . And since our Lord the King had become aware ot this , not wishing that anything should bo done now , or in time to come , which might be anywise turned against the liberty ot that estate for which they have come to Parliament , nor against the liberties oi the Lords aforesaid , he wills , grants , and declares , by the advice

      and assent ot . L . oras , manner as , — "" »" « •• ° * v-—That it is lawful for the Lords to consider among- themselves , in this present Parliament , and in every other in time to come , in the absence of the King , of the state of the lleulin , ami of the remedies needful for this . And in like manner it is lawful for the Commons on their part to consider among ' themselves on the same state and remedies . Provided always , that neither the Lords on their part , nor the Commons on theirs , should make any report to . our said Lord the King , of any grant , granted by the Commons and absented to by the Lords , nor of the discussions on the said grant , before that the said Lords and Commons are of one assent and of one accord in that matter ; and then in manner and form as is accustomed—that is to say , by the mouth of the Speaker of the said Commons for the time being ; so that the said Lords and Commons

      shall be agreed with our Lord the lying .. JJesides , ^ jvnig will ' s ^ with the assent of the Lords aforesaid , that the discussion m this present Parliament , had as above ^ should not be drawn into an exaniDle in time to come , nor be turned to the prejudice or derogation of the liberties of the estate for which the said Commons are now come , either in this present . Parliament nor ¦ in any other in . time hereafter . But Jie wills that they and all the other estates sltouldJbe as free as they were before . "—( Rolls of Parliament , 9 th IV . It was in 1628 that the preamble of Supply Bills was finally

      fixed , as we nowfind it : — "Most gTacious Sovereign , we your Msyesty s most faithful Commons have-given and granted to your Majesty . Oh the 7 th of Juno in that year , a committee , consisting of Sir h . Coke , Mr . Ghuiville , Mr . Seldeu , and many others , was appointed to , draw the preamble of the subsidy . In the preamble as so drawn , the Commons onlv were named , and the Lords omitted . To that omission the Lords took exception . Conferences were held , but the Commons ' adhered to their own form , for . " this course was not ¦ H : ^ uJ _ i . » .. _ t . l » iB .... TTnns <»; n * bninp- a dangerous eyaniplc in point-, of niter

      III . The most ancient manner of giving aids to the Crown was by the Lords and Commons , separately from each other , each for themselves only , and without mutual communication . But from a very early period the Lords and Commons joined together , and , since they did so , the fundamental rule Iras always been—the Commons grant , the Lords assent . In the great conferences held with the Lords in 1640 , nnd 1671 , and 1691 , reference is mode to thu " indemnity of , tho Lords and Commons , " 9 th Henvy IV ., 1407 . This precedent is so important that your committee think it right to give it in full : —r

      " On Wednesday , the 2 d day of December ( 140 /) , which was tho last dny of Parliament , the Commons came before the King and tho Lords in Parliament , nnd there , by command of the King , , u schedule of indemnity , on a ccrtnin altercation that hurl happened between the Lords and Commons , was road } nnd on this , it was commanded by tho King that the said schedulo should bo entered in record on the roll of Parliament ; the tenour of which schedule follows : — "Bo it remembered that , on Monday , the 21 st day of November , tho King our Sovereign Lord being in the Council Chamber within the Abboy of Gloeeater , there being in liia presenco tho Lords

      spiriconsequence . " Ultimately , the Lords pnss <> d the Jiill without - ing the preamble , but , contrary to ¦ u . ^ ngc , they retained \ the Bill hi their House , " to which much exception was ¦ taken . " Nevertheless , when tho King came ' "to prorogue Parliament , the Speaker presented it , praying His Majesty ' s Royal assent unto the Bill ¦ spnssed both Houses . " . , , _ , . , V . In the short Parliament of lti-U ) , tlie Kmg having come to the House ot Lords ' and deinancUnl a proai-nt supply , the Lords requested a conference , which wati held On the 25 th of April . A iniurlei with

      question arose whether tho Lords could in any way -o the Commons relative to the precedency which supply should have over other ' mutters . On tho 27 th oi" April tho Lords expressed to the Connnons their opinion that , in regard of tho urgency nnd even the necessity of the King's luTuirs , the Commons should begin with giving the King n supply , and a . . conference was desired on that subject .. The conference was hold , after which Mr . Herbert ; the Sol ' ieitor-Gonerul , reported , among other things , that tho Lords ufc the conference had stated that , '' though my Lords would not meddle with matters of subsidy-, which belonged naturally and properly to you , no , not to nive you advice therein , but have utterly declined ' it , yet , being members of one body , and subjects of , thu same King / and all concerned in thu common safety , and in their duty to itirt Majesty , and in their zeal and natural love to their country , themselves , and their posterity , they have declared by vote , ' That ' they hold it most necessary and lib that tho matter of supply should have precedency before imy other mutter or consideration whatsoever , ' nnd therefore desired ' » conference with you to let you know their reasons . " Upon this tho Commons resolved -t that , by the matter propounded in the late conference with the- Lords , this privileges oi ' lliiw'IIouao " are violated ; " - And furtlicn' , " tlinfc their Lordships voting , propounding , ami declaring , toudhiii | . r mutters ol supply , in such sort as is contained in this Itupovt . before it moved from this House , is n breiich of privilege of this House . "

      , On tho " 27 th of April n committee was appointed to . prepare an address unto the Lords for " righting their privileges . " The address waa presented by Mr . Pyin , n . t n conference held on tho 2 tfth of April . In this ' address Mr . Pyin nnid , " Your Lordships , ij \ the lust conference , have been pleased to affirm thut thu matter of subsidy and supply naturallv belonging- to the House oi'Commons , your

      tunl and temporal in this present Parliament assembled , it was discoursedamong them concerning the state of the kingdom , and how to ( lefeiKVit a ^ threatening the said king-dam nnd the faithful mibjcctn thereof ; and that ; this malice cannot bo resisted unless , for the pnfeguard and defence of his snid Inng-dom , our Sovereign Lord , the King have , in this present Parliament sonio comirlcriiblo aid and subsidy grunted to him . And On this , tho aforenamed Lords ashed , by way of question , —What aid would suffice and bo needful in this case ? To which demand and question it wns by the said Lords severally answered , —That , considering 1 the necessity of the King on tho one hand , ami tho poverty of his people cm tho other , Icsh nid would not

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      642 The Saturday Analyst and Leader . [ July 7 , I 860 .

      State Documents.

      STATE T ) Of ; i 7 MENTS .

  • Citation
    • Leader (1850-1860), July 7, 1860, page 642, in the Nineteenth-Century Serials Edition (2008; 2018) ncse-os.kdl.kcl.ac.uk/periodicals/l/issues/vm2-ncseproduct2355/page/18/